69 thoughts on “Our Daily Thread 8-25-17

  1. Good morning Kevin, Aj, et. al.
    It’s Friday. You know what that means?
    I see Peter has already been here on yesterday’s thread.

    Kevin, Re: Slide rules. I still have one. I can read it to three places.
    At Purdue, I was taking an advanced surveying course and spent a Sunday afternoon triangulating across Indiana. I spent the afternoon interpreting trig functions.
    Does anyone remember how to interpolate?
    I have dozens of useless skills.

    Some of you had a “One ring” signal to let people know you got there. I never used that.
    But when Chuck/Linda were in Spain and Mary/Tom were in China, I cold follow them on my iPhone. Linda had a program on the computer that could tell when Tom/Mary’s plane was on the way. I saw them over Canada.

    If I make a typo, you have to pass it by. I try, but the print is so small that I have a hard time proof reading my own post.

    Liked by 4 people

  2. I find this somewhat humorous. My friend M has been asked to prepare the food for the once a month wine tasting at the local Piggly Wiggly. Just those words–wine tasting at the “Pig”–makes me laugh. Last night we attended so she could get an idea of what to do going forward. She and I had already discussed ideas because she had called me the other day when she was asked. We laughed because while she got the offer there was the comment that what they really wanted was her friend Kim to run the tastings. So this week my joke has been that if this real estate gig doesn’t work I can always be the wine steward at the Pig.
    Anyway, it was a nicely done evening. We tasted Italian wines. All organically grown.
    A sweet white paired with Cannollini Bruschetta with sage olive oil
    A Rose’ with small batch bacon and cheese stacks. I could walk from my house to where this stuff is made.
    https://www.billesbacon.com/
    A spicy red with BBQ’d beef brisket
    Another red with Gambino’s lasagna
    A sparkling wine with homemade ice cream for dessert
    All for $15
    The place was packed. Where else could you get all that for $15?
    It still makes me laugh at where it was. As you can probably imagine I talked to the two strangers who were seated with us.

    Liked by 5 people

  3. Good morning. We will be off to my uncle’s funeral today. There was a newspaper article on him, as he was quite a community volunteer and teacher in certain areas of expertise. I am expecting it to be quite large with both a large family and then the community.

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  4. I noticed the mall comments, so will add my two cents. Our mall is changing to more of an outside entry type. Interesting, being that our weather can be so severe. I imagine less people are socializing in the inside and are in a hurry to hit one store and leave.

    We have had many store leave and be replaced by a gymnastics studio, a dog-training place and in another local mall, a church meeting place. No more bookstore, craft store or home dรฉcor places.

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  5. Hi. My computer at school died so I am using the one my students use. Anyway, here are the Friday Funnies.

    I’ll be emailing an pickled pigskin picks to AJ this weekend, since a few of you expressed an interest. It will be different without last year’s champion participating. Maybe someone can get her husband to fill her place.

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  6. Auburn is the only SEC team Carolina hasn’t beaten.
    We’ve beat ‘Bama, Ohio State, Notre Dame, Southern Cal, Texas
    All the famous football teams, at one time or another.
    Never played Oklahoma or Nebraska, that I remember.
    Except Auburn.. Never beat Auburn.

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  7. Chas, it might have been when our daughter was returning from her semester in Ireland, but I know at some point we were tracking someone’s plane and watching a map with this little plane interposed on it as it crossed vast swatches of the globe. And my husband commented that if we could do that with standard internet resources, so could every bad guy in the world. Somehow it seemed to dangerously compromise air travel.

    Now imagine authorities tracking any self-driving car in the world, with abilities to take over the driving and cause an accident any time they choose. They can already cause people to seem to commit suicide.

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  8. Chas, when you mentioned ‘One ring,’ I immediately thought of Lord of the Rings.

    Yesterday my brother and I attended a seminar, Defending Religious Freedom. A local ministry does this each year and brings in well known speakers along with local conservative state senators for a panel session, and this year, three of the four Republican candidates for governor spoke. It is a really good program for becoming informed on the state level. The keynote speaker was Judge Roy Moore, who I know is not Kim’s favorite over in AL. It was good to hear him speak. He was different than I had imagined him to be. My brother told me that Moore is not Trump’s pick for the Republican senate seat. We have relatives in AL that my brother keeps up with so he knows a lot about what happens over there. It is enough for me to try to keep up with what is happening in Atlanta.

    A long time ago I had a pastor who found fault with Roy Moore’s stance on the Ten Commandments plaque. The pastor said, “You can’t legislate morality.” Just wondering how anyone else feels about what the pastor said. At the time, I felt angered by his pat response.

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  9. Linda, I apologize if my comment was too political for this thread. Since my related question was meant for all, that is why I posted on this thread.

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  10. I watched my daughter return home from Uganda the same way, but too much knowledge can also be a problem. When six hours later, her plane still was not shown to have landed in Ethiopia, you can imagine where my brain went!

    When I bought my car, they tried hard to convince me to pay extra for something called LoJack. The idea behind this device was if my car was ever stolen, it could immediately be tracked and the return rate by police was high.

    He also told me I would save 20% on my comprehensive insurance.

    I texted my husband while I sat there. He couldn’t find any sign of that on the company’s website.

    The more the salesman talked, the more troubled I became. “So what do you think?” he finally asked.

    “It sounds to me like a Big Brother tracking device. No thanks.”

    I don’t want to be paranoid, but we are trading our “security and safety,” for a loss of liberty. I don’t know why more people don’t recognize that.

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  11. Speaking of malls and statues. My theory is that in fifty years, people will be looking back at us in disgust. They will be tearing down our monuments. Because we had people working in manual labor or as cashiers checking out our groceries. When we, if we were not such whatever the term of the day may be, would have been using robotic methods for those jobs.

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  12. Wine tasting at the Piggly Wiggly sounds like a sweet movie title. But there needs to be a dog in the cast. Wasn’t there a movie about a Piggly Wiggly, a little girl and a dog a few years back?

    I have 4 stories to write today. A couple of those, by necessity, will be short. ๐Ÿ™‚

    Today also is the final day for people to turn in applications for the, ahem, “voluntary separation” and receive 4 months pay and a goodbye, see ya wave. Sounds like company wide not many will take it, the package wasn’t that helpful for most people, even those who wanted to get out. Finances dictate those things for most of us, of course. Although our long-time newsroom assistant — who does a ton of work such as the police blotter, calendar style listings, pet of the week, letters to the editor — is going to go for it. She’s in her early 50s and is hoping to take some classes and find *something* else. Her big challenge will be health insurance as she’ll have to go onto Cobra (very expensive) and she has diabetes so needs a lot of medications, doctor apps, etc. But she really wants “out.”

    Like many of us, she’s been through the slide down hill for the past 20 years with furlough days, pulled benefits (including the 401K match more than a decade ago), pay cut, vacation cut, no raises, severe staff cuts, cut/cut/cut — and, on the other side, the constant “new dance” and reorganization / technology attempts that never seem to “work.” The latest will involve reporters learning how to do analytics and data analysis on their own stories to see which ones are most read (and so presumably what stories to do or ignore in the future). Something about that doesn’t seem right to those of us reporters who are “old school” and see news as news, period.

    Sorry to belabor the work woes (again), but it seems to be what’s on my mind first thing in the mornings these days. Sigh. There will be some sad goodbyes to colleagues in the coming week or two. And then there (again) will be fewer of us left to try to do the new thing that management imagines will fix it all.

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  13. Those robots NOW are sort of like those new soda machines in fast food places. They work fine but people back up behind them; there are too many choices!

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  14. Janice, on your question about the Ten Commandments plaque and legislating morality:
    The laws of any earthly nation can only go so far. It is impossible for humans to be able to fully judge heart attitudes and motivations, so we have to go by actions – “by their fruits, you shall know them.” We leave the judgement of the heart to the One who knows all things. I’ve been thinking about this lately, about how a nation’s criminal laws should seek to protect humans within the nation’s borders against theft – not just of property, but also of character, as in laws about slander and libel – and violence, both physical and sexual (which also is physical, but is differentiated in most law codes, perhaps because sexual violence also involves theft). In the recent issue that arose about free speech, I thought that a major point was missed, that the right of free speech does not protect speech that is used to incite violence – there is a law against conspiring to commit murder after all, and one conspires with others by talking to them. Such laws are within the capability of legislatures to write and courts to judge, because they deal with evidence that can be used in detecting and punishing a crime. We cannot detect the hatred or lust or greed that dwells in human hearts until their words and actions show the sin that dwells in them.

    So, to address the Ten Commandments plaques directly, there is a legitimate question about whether any secular nation can really uphold such commandments involving covetousness or idolatry. Those are attitudes of the heart, and furthermore, in a secular state that protects the free exercise of one’s religion, some religions involve the use of idols. I’ve said it before, and I’ll say it again, there is no such thing as a Christian nation while this earth lasts. The kingdom of God is within the hearts of the people God has called to his Son by his Spirit, and no earthly nation is comprised entirely of such people. The most we Christians can hope and pray for the earthly nations we live in is that we may live a quiet and peaceable life in all Godliness and honesty. Freedom of religion for all has been one way we have been able to live in quietness. Freedom of religion means that all religions are treated equally in the public square – that people are judged by their actions as individuals, not by who or what they worship. The Ten Commandments, and the rest of the law given to Moses, is described in the New Testament as a schoolmaster, to show us our sinfulness before a holy God, in order that we might turn to his Son, Jesus Christ, who fulfilled the law. Such an evangelistic use of the commandments is not for the secular state to carry out, but for the Church.

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  15. My friend and I did walk through a candle shop (run by Body & Bathworks) at the Valley mall last week, but no one else was there and the clerks just stood there looking bored. I’ll bet they’re gone by next year, too. Shopping has changed, most people no longer go to malls to actually buy things.

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  16. DJ, wrong chain for girl and dog. I think you’re thinking of Because of Winn-Dixie. I read the book, though, didn’t see the movie. I liked it.

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  17. I gathered from what I heard yesterday that the Ten Commandments he displayed were meant to be a reminder that the laws of our nation were based on God’s laws. A lot of what he said had to do with our nation’s continuing bent on failing to acknowledge God in any manner. At times I had trouble following his talk because he speaks very fast, at times, and with a bit of an accent (charming, of course, yet unfamiliar to me).

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  18. You can’t legislate morality.
    However, a nation’s laws reflect it’s moral state.
    Abortion, Homosexual marriage, narcotics. etc. reflect a nation that is degrading spiritually.
    I mentioned yesterday, I am reading a book called The End of America. I don’t agree with the author in every point.
    But he makes some good points. It is not the same America that I knew and each issue makes it worse, not better.

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  19. Oh, that’s right, Win Dixie — I knew it was one of those stores we didn’t have in California ๐Ÿ™‚

    Our homeless story apparently got a Drudge link today so now I’m getting emails from people all over about how to solve homelessness.

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  20. But the laws of the United States are not based on the Ten Commandments. The basis of U.S. law is English Common Law. The primary law text that the Founding Fathers of the U.S. studied was William Blackstone’s Commentaries on the Laws of England, which played such an important role in developing the U.S. Constitution that they have been quoted in U.S. Supreme Court decisions. English Common Law was built over centuries of trial and error, and its origins history goes back to before England became primarily Christian, to the laws not only of the Roman Empire, but also the Celtic tribes which inhabited England as well as the Angles, Saxon, and Nordic tribes which later invaded and settled in England. In the beginning of the letter to the Romans, Paul notes that those nations who were without the law of Moses did by nature the things written in the law of Moses, demonstrating that those laws were written in the hearts of humans. We see those natural laws at work . in the account of Cain killing Abel, when God says that the blood of Abel cried out from the ground. Later, in the covenant with Noah, God declares that the killing of a human requires payment in kind, because humans were created in the image of God. The covenant with Noah applied to all his descendants, not just those of the line of Shem, from whom Abraham and Moses came.

    So, while the laws of the U.S. have similarities to the Ten Commandments, that is simply because human beings are subject to the universal laws of their Creator. Let me illustrate what I mean by using another set of historical laws, the early Babylonian Code of Hammurabi. Because this code predates the Mosaic law, modern secular scholars like to say that the striking similarities between Hammurabi’s code and Moses law are evidence that Hammurabi influenced the early Jewish laws of Moses. In doing so, they not only conveniently discount any kind of divine revelation to Moses, but also what I was just talking about, that the laws of nature are a universal influence on all humans, no matter what their nation and its history. So, when it comes to U.S. history, while the Ten Commandments may have influenced the Founding Fathers through their religious practice, the actual lineage of their law practice does not directly stem from Moses’ law, since the inhabitants of Europe, and thus England, were descended from a different branch of Noah’s family than Shem.

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  21. Can a nation acknowledge God’s laws? Not really. Individuals within that nation acknowledge, or fail to acknowledge, God’s laws. But the new covenant is not with America; it is with the church, His body.

    I don’t like the idea of reducing God’s laws to a plaque to show the history of law in this nation. If you are teaching a law class, by all means bring in the Ten Commandments. But remember that law never saved anyone–all it can do is show us our helplessness to keep it and our need for Christ. And it is the job of the church, not the public square, to show that!

    I imagine there are legal grounds for a Christian judge to display the Ten Commandments in his courtroom, if there is precedent that a judge has any say on what goes up on his courtroom walls. But remember, another judge may someday choose to post sharia, or a statue of Baal. Be careful what you wish for.

    I think that overall these fights over Ten Commandments monuments and nativity scenes in the public square are a distraction. A court battle over what a Christian may put on his front lawn (as long as it fits within community ordinances) or what a church may display is one thing, but insisting on our “rights” to display the Ten Commandments in public is worse than useless. And it shows a grave misunderstanding of the Christian’s place in public life. We are not here to force public acceptance of our views and to highlight God’s law; we are there to point people who are convicted that they break the law to the grace of God in Christ.

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  22. Cheryl, I definitely agree that fights over the Ten Commanadments plaques and Nativity scenes in public spaces are a waste of energy. In the city where I go to school, the city hall puts out a Christmas tree, and a Nativity scene in December, as well as a large Hannukah menorah, and I’ve also seen banners over the main street wishing people a Happy Eid (a Muslim celebration). I know that Sikhs had a parade for one of their saint’s days, and I wouldn’t be surprised to see Dilwale or Holi banners up (Hindu festivals). I do know the university had a Holi celebration on campus last year. In allowing one religion to express themselves in the public square, they can only in justice under our laws, allow the others equal public expression time when inhabitants of the city who are of those other religions request it. Either all religions practiced by citizens of a nation with freedom of religion have the opportunity to use public space or none.

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  23. Are or were you discussing Judge Roy Moore of Alabama? He is a whack a loon and will not get my vote. If HE can’t follow the laws of our state how can I trust him to follow the laws of our nation?

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  24. Blackstone was mentioned, and I wish I had a head that retains more historical facts. Maybe I can ask my brother if he remembers that part. It was probably in discussion of the God of nature’s laws who also gave the Ten Commandments.

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  25. It is true whether by spiritual or cultural/civil realms, laws never can make people moral. That’s why we as Christians realize our need of Jesus. But the laws in either realm do help guide people in what they need to do to keep within the bounds of a society that cares for all its citizens. The left tries awfully hard to legislate morality as they define it. Interesting to see how that has done a complete turn around from one side of unreasonableness to the other. We came from expecting the left to live by God’s standards when they were unbelievers to relaxing that expectation. They did not leave it at that. Now we have a grand case of chaos.

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  26. God, though he wrote the laws of nature, only gave the Ten Commandments to Israel for actual practice in judiciary proceedings. To us, they hold a spiritual significance, not a judicial one. That spiritual significance is beyond the purview of a secular government and judiciary to expound upon.

    I know so much about the history of the U.S. because, being homeschooled, many of my textbooks and study materials were of U.S. publication – not just ATI, but also A Beka and Bob Jones University Press. I learned the U.S.-is-a-Christian-nation-that-is-forsaking-its-roots line, and not just from the homeschooling materials – our dear Pastor A, after coming back from the mission field, had served in a U.S. Bible school and still had many connections there. He would share the latest news on religious freedom in the U.S. in Sunday School. I realize, looking up Roy Moore, that he was one of the people our pastor talked about, fighting to maintain Christianity in the U.S. via a Ten Commandments monument. Pastor A, though he taught the Bible consistently, was as dyed-in-the-wool politically conservative as it gets. I challenged him once or twice when he brought his conservatism into his Christianity in ways I could see contradicted Scripture, and he was gracious enough to concede my point. So between my homeschooling and my church influences, I was raised into the whole conservative/Republican-equals-Christian mindset. I started to question that supposed link as I began to search the Bible for how I as a Christian ought to live. I realized that what the Bible told Christians to do in their secular nations, and what the conservative culture told me to do were usually two very different things.

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  27. Janice, it is true that the left/liberal/progressive political movement is practically fundamentalist. When we try to achieve righteousness by the works of the flesh, whether that righteousness is perfect human equality, or perfect moral purity, it is doomed to failure. Legalism is deadly in all its forms.

    There are other cultures that are very little influenced by Christianity which have similar codes against certain moral failures. It is interesting to note that those cultures also have conservative reactionary elements. It is most clearly seen in primarily Islamic countries such as Pakistan, where liberalizing forces are in constant struggle against conservative forces such as the Taliban. Iran was at one time quite liberal, before the Ayatollahs brought in Islamic conservatism. India is right now under the governance of a conservative party, which, in reaction to the liberalizing elements in that country, is calling for a return to a pure Hindu state. Muslims, as well as Christians, and other religions in that country of many religions, are threatened by the Hindu nationalist movement and have been murdered by mobs and assassins. Seeing that makes me realize that the solution is not to turn back the clock.

    Those states which have tried to go back in order to restore moral balance have simply become more repressive. Witness the state ISIS tried to form – they claimed to be restoring the caliphate, but the rich and powerful caliphs of ancient Baghdad would have been executed by ISIS for their secular education (we got algebra and the preservation of Aristotle’s philosophy from those ancient caliphates), permissiveness towards other religions (a family of Assyrian Christians served as royal physicians to the caliph of Baghdad for generations), and luxurious lifestyles (the courts and harems of Baghdad were centres of music, art, and poetry). We like to think the West was a more moral place at one time, but the reality was that life was just too hard to be foolish. Where luxury existed, moral chaos did too. Homosexuality and cross-dressing were openly practiced in the luxurious courts of Europe. When considering the options for how to govern the U.S., the idea was briefly considered of asking Prince Henry of Prussia, the younger brother of Frederick the Great, to rule the new country. Prince Henry was an open homosexual, who despite a state marriage, made no effort to conceal his preferences. The courts of European rulers had no moral superiority over the harems of Eastern rulers. The U.S. itself may have seemed more moral, but it was a new country, with little luxury to indulge in, and the same with Canada. Now, they have attained higher levels of luxury than even those old courts could boast. “This was the sin of thy sister Sodom, pride, fullness of bread, and abundance of idleness…” (Ezekiel 16:49)

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  28. I still need to catch up on the comments here, which I hope to do tonight, but seeing part of the conversation reminds me of something I wanted to pass by you all.

    Some months ago, there was a theological discussion on a Facebook post by former WMB regular Kyle A. Another former regular TJ (Cameron’s husband, a Presbyterian minister) insisted that the burning at the stake of Michael Servetus was a good thing. He said that Christians who think of it as wrong have been too influenced by the Enlightenment, & that heresy is bad enough that stamping it out by putting someone to death, as a warning to others, was warranted.

    I was pretty shocked at that. I thought that maybe Kyle would engage with him about it, as he often has long, involved discussions on various matters on his Facebook posts, but he didn’t reply to that.

    Was I right to feel that that was wrong? I know that heresy is obviously a very bad thing, but was burning at stake warranted?

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  29. Kizzie, what does the New Testament say about dealing with heretics? Does it extend the right to take life to the Church? It doesn’t, does it? In fact, Paul specifically gives the use of the sword to execute justice to the state. Is there such a thing as a Christian state according to the New Testament? Jesus told Pilate that his kingdom was not of this world, so the answer would be no.
    Christians who believe that the Church cannot enact anything other than excommunication against erring members are simply following the New Testament teaching on Church government. The council of Geneva was wrong in burning Servetus at the stake because the it was influenced by the prevalent practice of the day, that of combining Church and state to the point that the Church wielded the sword of the state.

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  30. There will be a run off in Alabama between Luther Strange and Roy Moore. I voted for Tripp Pitman. I can vote in the run off and will vote for someone other than Strange or Moore as a write in candidate. When it comes to the General Election I will vote for the Democrat Doug Jones.
    Electing Moore will cause embarrassment to Alabama and Strange bears the stench of our former Luv Gov.

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  31. The NT does not support violence in any form by Christians.
    Not even in self defense, though I, personally, would not oppose it.
    That is just an opinion. Not ex-cathedra.

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  32. I cannot believe that these words are about to pass my lips…
    Thank you Dear Lord for Hurricane Harvey. Wolf Blitzer has something besides impeaching Donald Trump to talk about.

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  33. Roscuro – That is my feeling, too. But that other attitude, coming from a Presbyterian minister, who used to be “one of us”, made me wonder if others agreed with him. His mention of today’s Christians being too influenced by the Enlightenment seemed dismissive of any potential disagreement. As I said, I was shocked by his comment.

    I was hoping Kyle would have engaged with him on it, as it would have been an interesting discussion. Maybe TJ would have expanded on his first comment, or modified it somehow. But that comment was as far as the discussion went. Maybe Kyle didn’t have time at the time to get into it.

    Kyle is one of a few of my Facebook friends who has interesting, thought-provoking posts & discussions on a variety of topics, with people of differing views, sometimes vastly different views.

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  34. Kim, why do you want to vote in the runoff? Is there a chance for the write-in candidate? I really don’t know much about AL politics. I think I’m GA that we can only vote in the runoff if we voted in the election prior to it according to the same party. Did you vote Republican in the primary, but then you will vote for the Democrat in the general election?

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  35. Excuse me if someone already made this point (re: the discussion on laws & morality). Still catching up.

    Something to keep in mind is that the laws for abortion & same-sex marriage & the like, or the striking down of laws against homosexual conduct, came after the public was already engaging in these things, & wanted the laws changed to reflect that. (Although there were more abortions after abortion became legal.)

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  36. Kim, I have the U. S. Representative who said if we increased our military presence on Guam that it would sink. And previously I was blessed with the one who hit a capitol police officer for not recognizing her with her new hairstyle. So I know about loonies, LOL. There are loonies and then there are others who are capital LOONIES, LOL.

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  37. I voted in the Republican Primary so I will vote in the R run off. I don’t want either of them to think they are a strong candidate. Luther Strange is the hand picked “boy” of the RNC.
    I will vote for the Democrat to try to keep either Moore or Strange from going to Washington.

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  38. Janice – Was that comment about Guam tipping over serious or could it have been a joke? I know there have been times when a politician has said something in jest or sarcasm, but their remarks were reported as if they were serious. There is the temptation to recognize that in politicians we like, but not in politicians we dislike.

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  39. I think every state has had loonies for Reps at least once. Missouri has US Senator Claire McCaskill. She is only half loonie. An Illinois next door? Well, at least one of them left to be President.

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  40. Kizzie,

    Yeah, no. He was totally serious. He was worried too many Marines might cause it to tip.

    Here’s the video. The look on the General’s face is priceless. ๐Ÿ™‚


    ————————

    Make sure you stick around for the second video where the Congressman discusses midgets. Hank could give Maxine Waters a run for engineer of the crazy train.

    And here’s the Snopes Fact Check.

    http://www.snopes.com/politics/quotes/guamtip.asp

    “Rep. Hank Johnson said he feared that stationing 8,000 Marines on Guam would cause the island to ‘become so overly populated that it will tip over and capsize.’

    “True”

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  41. Thanks, AJ, for saving my reputation for knowing a Loonie from a LOONIE! Hank Johnson is a Buddist (or at least he was when I last checked). I have never seen him in person, but I suppose I could make an appointment to see him. One could only hope he was doing a comedy routine, but it was a serious consideration he had regarding Guam. His predecessor moved to California. I hope that is trending for Representatives from my district. Watch out Donna and Michelle!
    The invasion of the LOONIES has begun.

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  42. Thanks Bob, I hadn’t seen that — more emails. We had some doozies via the Drudge link today. I think this has happened (a power line link) once before

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  43. I was wring. I thought it was an intelligent person making the statement.
    It was the questioner. Seems like an idiot to me. But that one clip is all I have.

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