Bishop asks Trump to “have mercy” on immigrants and gay peopleHow should we see this issue through the lens of Scripture?
by Dr. Jim Denison
Washington National Cathedral in Washington, D.C. By SergeyNovikov/stock.adobe.com.
The Presidential Inaugural Prayer Service is a tradition that stretches back to 1933 and the inauguration of Franklin Delano Roosevelt. The service is held at the Washington National Cathedral, the second-largest church building in the US. The cathedral is the seat of the Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church and the bishop of the Diocese of Washington. Since 2011, the latter role has been held by Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde, the first woman to serve in this position.
In her sermon during this year’s service on Tuesday, the bishop made a direct appeal to President Trump: “I ask you to have mercy upon the people in our country who are scared now. There are gay, lesbian, and transgender children in Democratic, Republican, and independent families, some who fear for their lives.”
Then she spoke to the issue of illegal immigration and deportation:
The people who pick our crops and clean our office buildings; who labor in poultry farms and meat packing plants; who wash the dishes after we eat in restaurants and work the night shifts in hospitals, they—they may not be citizens or have the proper documentation. But the vast majority of immigrants are not criminals. They pay taxes and are good neighbors.
Toward the end of her sermon, she said:
I ask you to have mercy, Mr. President, on those in our communities whose children fear that their parents will be taken away, and that you help those who are fleeing war zones and persecution in their own lands to find compassion and welcome here. Our God teaches us that we are to be merciful to the stranger, for we were all once strangers in this land. “To do justice, and to love kindness”
The bishop has long been a strong critic of Mr. Trump. He responded in turn after the service, calling her “a Radical Left hard line Trump hater” who “brought her church into the world of politics in a very ungracious way.” He added, “She failed to mention the large number of illegal migrants that came into our country and killed people. Many were deposited from jails and mental institutions. It is a giant crime wave that is taking place in the USA.”
How should we see this issue through the lens of Scripture?
As I note in my book, The State of Our Nation: 7 Critical Issues, illegal immigration is a complex issue. Scripture teaches, “You shall not wrong a sojourner or oppress him, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt” (Exodus 22:21). The Bible consistently calls us to care for immigrants (cf. Leviticus 19:33–34; Deuteronomy 10:18–19; 24:19–22; Ezekiel 47:21–23; Zechariah 7:10; Malachi 3:5; Hebrews 13:2; Matthew 25:35). And we are told that God loves all of us, regardless of our place of origin (Galatians 3:26–29).
At the same time, immigrants or sojourners in the Bible are not in their countries illegally. Immigrants are to obey the law and customs of the land (Isaiah 56:6–7) and to assimilate into the culture of their host country (Deuteronomy 5:14; 16:9–15). They are not to break the law, no matter how difficult their circumstances (Proverbs 6:30–31).
In addition, the Bible consistently affirms the importance of border security: “When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he divided mankind, he fixed the borders of the peoples” (Deuteronomy 32:8). The Promised Land’s borders are delineated in Numbers 34:1–15 and Ezekiel 47:13–23. We are told, “Do not move the ancient landmark that your fathers have set” (Proverbs 22:28).
With regard to LGBTQ persons, Scripture teaches that all people are made in God’s image and likeness (Genesis 1:27a) and that the Father loves each of us as much as he loves his own Son (John 17:23, 26). However, we are also told that “male and female he created them” (Genesis 1: 27b). Marriage in the Bible is clearly a covenant between one man and one woman (Genesis 2:18–25; Ephesians 5:22–33; Colossians 3:18–19). Sexual relations are intended only for men and women within this covenant (Exodus 20:14; Hebrews 13:4; Leviticus 18:22; 20:13; Romans 1:26–27; 1 Corinthians 6:9–11; 1 Timothy 1:8–11).
While Scripture repeatedly calls us to be merciful to others (Luke 6:36; James 2:13; Matthew 5:7), it also calls us to seek justice and to uphold the rule of law (Isaiah 1:17; Amos 5:24; Proverbs 21:15), a role that is especially assigned to governmental leaders (Romans 13:1–7).
Micah 6:8 expresses well the biblical balance we seek: “What does the Lᴏʀᴅ require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?” (my emphases). “The greatest favor I can do for others”
As you can see, the issues raised by Bishop Budde are complex, both from a biblical perspective and with regard to practical factors and consequences. In fact, I plan to write a website article later today that explores this complexity in greater detail than space permits here.
However, with all due respect to the bishop, rather than challenging the president directly while giving voice to only one side of the debate, I believe she should have taken this opportunity to focus on Jesus and invite those in the Cathedral and around the world to personal faith in him.
She later said the service was intended as a “one-on-one conversation with the president.” But what about everyone else in attendance and those who would hear later about the controversy she had to know would ensue?
I agree with my friend, the Anglican leader David Roseberry, who said the bishop “closed a door” when she “delivered a lecture—aimed not at the congregation, but at a single member in it. The pulpit became a podium, the sanctuary a platform for ethical and political instruction.”
In his view, “The subject of every sermon should always be Jesus Christ and no one else.” He believes the bishop’s message “would better have been said in another place at another moment” and adds: “The sermon was an opportunity—a singular, sacred one—to speak to the hearts of those gathered and to proclaim the gospel of Jesus Christ to those in attendance and around the world.”
Let’s not miss the opportunity to “speak to the hearts” of the people we meet today. We can win debates and lose souls. When we address the issues of our day, we should leverage them to lead to personal faith in Jesus (cf. John 4:19–26). He alone can change the human heart and bring his kingdom “on earth as it is in heaven” (Matthew 6:10).
Paul Little was right:
“Witnessing is that deep-seated conviction that the greatest favor I can do for others is to introduce them to Jesus Christ.”
“John Eastman has articulated many times the clear argument against birthright citizenship. His argument is straight forward, it rests on history and precedent, and it avoids the absurd result we have today. Here are his basic points: 🧵”
“The Democrat ranking member on the armed services committee works with the same law firm where Pete Hegseth’s sister-in-law works. You know the same sister-in-law that signed an affidavit saying that there was abuse in their marriage. You know the same affidavit that the actual ex-wife has denied on the record.”
Janice, I don’t take issue with much of that @9:50, he hit on good points and I think we all agree that showing mercy on the sojourner and immigrants among us does not preclude upholding the laws of the land which also need to be maintained in terms of our border.
He included some quotes from Trump later that sounded rather mild.
But there were other things the president said in the aftermath that were not so gracious.
“Apart from her inappropriate statements, the service was a very boring and uninspiring one. She is not very good at her job!” he posted after midnight. “She and her church owe the public an apology!” (Truth Social)
–Trump called Budde a “Radical Left hard line Trump hater” on his Truth Social site on Wednesday.–
I’m sorry to see this new administration starting out on what may have been a predictable note. The vitriol is not helpful for a nation already so deeply divided (Trump won but not by all that much). With the pardons for virtually all of the Jan. 6 offenders, including those who committed violent acts against police officers and now are feeling empowered, it’s starting off on a note that I don’t see as ending well or helping to move the nation in a more stable direction.
Some things are best left in the “let it go” category while in the heat of the moment. The church service, I think, was one of those.
Trump’s Truth Social statements (posted often in the wee hours and which I only see afterward when they’re quoted elsewhere) don’t portray a picture of a man who is a mature, capable or wise leader.
He has always sounded “off” to me, immature, emotional, too often angry, and always reactive in a way that doesn’t usually make for good national leadership.
I agree with some of the issues he supports. But the man himself and his character continue to give me concern.
“While anti-Trump National Cathedral Rev. Mariann Budde claims to champion the poor and decries the “appalling disparity between rich and poor,” property records show she lives in a $2 million+ colonial mansion with 6 bedrooms and 4.5 bathrooms in a leafy DC neighborhood”
I thought Trump’s comments on the bishop and the service were appropriate given that she used God’s pulpit to inappropriately further the aims of sodomites and child groomers. In fact, the comments were relatively mild. He would not have been wrong to stand up and leave (at least one representative did). But, on balance, I’m glad he didn’t. He showed respect to the church by staying. It was the bishop who was dishonoring in every way.
AJ? @11:00 — I believe that was already discussed in the previous day.
Meanwhile, another school shooting 😦
~ Two students are dead and one injured after a 17-year-old male student armed with a handgun opened fire in the cafeteria of Antioch High School in Nashville on Wednesday morning.
The student then fatally shot himself, according to the Metro Nashville Police Department.
The shooter, identified as Solomon Henderson by Metro Nashville Police, was a 17-year-old student at the school.
Nashville Police Chief John Drake said during a 2:30 p.m. news conference there are online “materials” that are factoring into the police’s investigation. “As to a motive, we’re looking into that,” Drake said. “There are some materials on the internet that we’re looking at that’s under the investigation.” ~
“With the pardons for virtually all of the Jan. 6 offenders, including those who committed violent acts against police officers and now are feeling empowered…”
Have any of them made statements to that effect? I doubt anyone who has been through the political/legal wringer the way many of those people have are feeling empowered. Probably relieved, but nothing about those pardons is empowering. Many lost their health, reputations, livelihoods, etc. Things they will never get back. I was glad to see that they were all pardoned or commuted, especially since it was blatantly politically motivated. They served enough jail time and punishment for any crimes. And yes, accepting a pardon does legally mean you are confessing guilt.
Correction: accepting a pardon “carries an imputation of guilt and acceptance of a confession of it,…” according to Burdick v. United States. Lawyers will argue about it I suppose, but it seems to me a strong “imputation” of guilt.
There seems to be more of a “blanket” motion in the end for the J6 offenders and from clips of Trump I’ve seen that went against earlier pledges he had made not to include those convicted of violent acts (and Vance as well).
If I’m wrong I am willing to be corrected. But I believe the only ones left incarcerated are those who are still mired in their own legal processes, and that’s about 3 people?
DJ, I. Believe you are correct concerning the blanket. But he did give his reason: they have already served their time beyond that normally given for said offenses. Sure, the optics would have been better to hold them a tad longer.
Sadly, I am still reading about the many policemen killed by the mob while I am not aware of any killed by the mob. Several suicides and a medical or two.
the woman in the pulpit concern: that seems to be a fairly common thing in leftward leaning churches. Meaning their focus appears to be more on social justice or compassion than on knowing God. And they begin to have more same leaning writings to support their direction and encourage that rather than clear Scripture which also says care for the poor and the widows and the children.
The real, BBC has a piece on the released and quotes one as saying he is glad Trump is not looking for retribution and moving forward but he (the proud boy) is not holding himself to the same standard. He believes the committee needs jail time.
A lady around here is trying to get her release rescinded. She believes she was participating in criminal activity and should go through the court system.
“The new controversy of Biden’s Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm at the last minute on Thursday sending more than $15B in Biden’s green energy loans to utilities in her home state of Michigan is a major wake up call to the significant taxpayer abuses in the Biden White House. Many of them are her donors to her gubernatorial campaign. Granholm approved a massive $22.9B in these 11th hour green loans, sending nearly 70% of that to Michigan, the Beacon reports, either feathering her political nest or her future in the private sector. Democrats hammered President Trump when he campaigned on draining the swamp in 2016. Nancy Pelosi and Democrats pushed back hard to impeach him on one of 85 targets they launched. This also defies the energy department Inspector General who told Granholm to stop the conflicts of interest in these $400B slush funds. This highlights too a government abuse of power sending hundreds of billions of dollars in taxpayer money out the door that gets recycled as campaign donations. This is one of the most underreported stories out there. Whose back is getting scratched and for how much? “
I think the police union isn’t smiling on any of it. Interesting that at least one woman (@2:28) thinks she should serve her time.
And a few have come forward now expressing personal regret about their participation or that they showed up only to see what unfolded.
I haven’t looked in on Babylon Bee in quite a while, they seemed to lose their funny-edge in my mind — or maybe it just got old, tired, or too political.
The first post is probably the best conservative Christian analysis I’ve read on the bishop’s words. However, I do think in the context of an inauguration prayer service, a direct message to the incoming president and admin is appropriate. For many on the left, a pastor spoke on mercy and compassion using Jesus’s words and the Christian right and Trump were upset — on the surface level, this speaks volumes to people.
Imagine the situation in reverse from your perspective. Biden in a Catholic church forced to listen to a pro-life sermon. I don’t think anyone here would argue against the message nor its directness. And I can imagine the criticism if Biden walked out.
Trump’s posture and social media posts reveal immaturity and disrespect for the institution if not the church. But this is par for the course for him in almost any setting.
I have to give the lady in Idaho credit — I committed a criminal offence and I should pay the penalty. Unlike the post I came across where a man thanks Trump for the pardon and then says he’s off to buy some “motherfxxkin” guns. I suppose he’s celebrating the fact he can buy guns again as he’s no longer a convicted felon but it comes across wrong.
mumsee — I believe there’s three prisoners on federal death row who want to turn the commuted sentence down as they are still appealing their conviction
Almost all of the Americas have birthright citizenship — it makes sense for immigrant based countries. Australia, NZ and western Europe also have birthright citizenship but with restrictions.
X links that lead to threads are impossible to follow without an account. I’d be interested in how someone argues against the 14th Amendment and over 100 years of judicial tradition.
The countries with restrictions usually want at least one parent to be a legal resident of a certain time limit or the child has to wait until 18, refugees or migrants may be treated differently than legal immigrants, etc. Instead of an executive order, this might be the way forward for those who want to limit birth right citizenship — might be easier to square with the 14th Amendment.
DJ, after I posted I did see one video of proud boys being very exuberant upon their release. I can see how certain statements made could be considered as feeling empowered or maybe even justified. That’s unfortunate. But to me it’s not a sufficient reason to withhold a pardon or commutation given the political nature of the “justice” given them. They were not treated like ordinary offenders or like the multitude of rioters just a few months before.
Opinions will vary of course.
Along with you, I am hopeful that this thread can maintain it’s respectful tone, as well as avoid the equally discouraging tone of tiresome preachiness all too often on display.
HRW, correct, I had forgotten about them, with legitimate reason to be pardoned or stay in and fight. I guess I was wondering about the others, including the ones never charged with anything. Seems like an ugly anchor to put on any innocent friends or family.
Citizenship: I told you about my son, the un citizen. Brought over for adoption from Ethiopia. The adoption failed before completion. They signed him over to us but though we adopted him, we could not get him citizenship. Ethiopia revoked his citizenship when he left to be adopted. He was a boy without a country until the Navy took him in and fast tracked citizenship. Our systems in everything related to federal are very very complicated. I hope that gets improved soon.
When the birthright citizenship issue was decide decades ago, it was noted that this applied to citizens children, not the children of illegal immigrants. Our govt keeps ignoring this fact. Below is a link with the author of the 14ths commentary on the matter. It was never intended as they pretend it is today.
“I wouldn’t be so sure about that. There are solid legal positions arguing that Birthright Citizenship was never intended to be applied to foreign nationals visiting the country. From the author of the 14th Amendment:”
—-
“This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens….”
“This is your reminder that basically no one for the first 100 years after the 14th Amendment’s ratification thought that it mandated birthright citizenship for the U.S.-born children of illegal or nonimmigrant aliens.static.”
People need to educate themselves on just what type of un-American garbage these Jan6 “trials” were. Read it, or continue to pretend you’re ignorant of what really happened so your wrong opinion is fine. It’s not.
“Thank you again for your generous words and yes, this is what happened in nearly every case. Some are worse—judges deny defense motions to enter exculpatory video into evidence, deny defense motions for witnesses who could describe police excessive force or use of govt agents, etc.”
In my sentencing the govt. prosecutor and FBI agent lied to the judge and said I wore body armor to the Capitol and was prepared for “political violence”, just so the judge would add more prison time to my sentence.
Both statements were complete lies and that knew it.
“I know the DOJ online database is offensive to the defendants because it seems like some registry but it helped me to understand that what i was hearing about the prosecutions was real….it was not an exaggeration. The charges for the overwhelming majority WERE misdemeanors..parading or trespass…things that have happened many times in that building over the years and continue to happen. Yet those instances were handled like….misdemeanors…fines or dismissals but the DOJ Prosecutors and Judges AND MEDIA were not going to allow that to happen. It was a project..a conspiracy. Looking at other protests like the May 29, 2020 organized attempt to breach the WH WITH the President in residence with serious injuries to over 100 Officers or Secret Service was handled completely differently. And I knew like we all knew…this was POLITICAL persecution..not law enforcement, not justice. That J6 committee was an exercise in tyranny meant to destroy Donald Trump and his supporters and the Conservative movement.
The effort failed…..but the carnage done to the J6 victims is a terrible scourge on the Justice system and the nation but TOO large a percentage of the Country will not acknowledge that. The Dems and media will continue the Psy Op. Pardons are a start…a select committee to examine the J6 committee will be welcome but the real test of Justice must come from Civil Judgements and a VERY Public lawsuit to pound home the crimes committed against J6’ers by our own Government”
In one of his comments, HRW writes, ” For many on the left, a pastor spoke on mercy and compassion using Jesus’s words and the Christian right and Trump were upset — on the surface level, this speaks volumes to people.”
Yeah, coming out against someone urging mercy does not look or sound good. One Christian friend of a friend on Facebook called her a demon. Another called her despicable and hateful.
I watched that part of the video. Although I do not agree with her religious stance, I thought that her voice sounded calm and had a pleading quality to it.
As for her remark about some people being afraid, she is right about that. Whether or not that fear is justified, it is there.
So over half of our legal citizens want deportations of invaders. They are tired of Americans providing for those here illegally.
A rally held in Denver of illegal invaders complaining about how scared they are. “A big chunk of people see me as an animal” is manipulation at its finest. No Virginia there is no Santa Claus. Come here legally with means to be a productive legal citizen of this country.
A sooth sayer calling for mercy while wearing a cleric collar doesn’t persuade me. Her activist life contrary to biblical direction falls flat. Of course believers taking a stand against such feel the wrath of pacifists and those bent on finding fault with those taking a stand against those demanding acceptance. So open your door to someone as they demand you provide everything for them. That’s not how this works.
Joseph said mass deportations would have detrimental consequences for Colorado families.
“Mass deportations will have a profound impact on our children and families,” said Joseph.
Though Trump plans to focus on criminals initially, some of his supporters said they would like to see all undocumented immigrants deported.
A recent New York Times poll found 55% of Americans would support deporting all undocumented immigrants.
“I think that’s really regrettable that this man has been able to pull the wool over Americans’ eyes, and now a big chunk of people see me as an animal, as a threat when I am just here trying to invest my talents in this country,” said Solano-Cordova.
It’s easy to get caught up in the political turmoil (and not always healthy for our own Christian walk), especially more recently.
I keep up but (purposely) not in a deep-dive, obsessive or emotional way (or at least I try) with the political arguments and divisions of the day.
I tend to be conservative but also with some centrist leanings so my kind of “politics” aren’t very popular with anyone right now. I’m definitely on the outside looking in.
And that’s fine, I’ve pretty much gotten “over” the rough-and-tumble, ugly side of politics through the years as my perspectives have changed and as I’ve also realized it’s not that spiritually or emotionally healthy (for me).
We’re in a difficult, over-heated political climate right now and I guess I think a certain amount of detachment is maybe healthy.
I know I’ve been asked this question before (and I’ve answered it) so I’ll ask it of others who are on the “other side” if you will: Is there anything about Trump that concerns you? Any positions he takes or statements he makes that you might find yourself in disagreement with (even while still supporting him generally)?
NJ – Is your comment, which includes this: “A rally held in Denver of illegal invaders complaining about how scared they are. . .” related to my comment which included this: “As for her remark about some people being afraid, she is right about that. Whether or not that fear is justified, it is there”?
In case it is, let me clarify that I was referring to people in the LGBTQ+ “community”. They are afraid that the Trump administration is going to be harmful to them in one way or another.
But it has been a couple days since I heard that snippet from the woman’s sermon/speech, so maybe I’ve forgotten whom she was referring to in that part about people being scared.
Debra @3:58 – “tiresome preachiness all too often on display.”
Hoping you’re not referring to people here (perhaps it was the minister or others in the “news cycle” you were referring to?). I think we’re all trying to just speak clearly. I understand that we will simply disagree on some (or many) things. I’m trying to be careful, and I’m hoping people can try to listen to what others are saying, but simply agree to disagree sometimes, then say their piece (peacefully).
We live in a very divided and even angry political culture right now. None of this is easy for any of us.
Speaking of Trump’s stance being disrespectful, I disagree. I consider it to be his listening stance. He is focused on what the individual is saying, not on the cameras or on people’s opinion. You can see it when he is talking to dignitaries, news media, people in mourning, etc. And afterwords it is clear he actually heard the individual and was able to have a coherent two way conversation, and the individual feels valued.
Watching others, who may look more attentive or respectful, they often appear to be trying to come up with their next words while not listening.
“I thought that her voice sounded calm and had a pleading quality to it.”
And thus are many seduced. I wonder how many teenagers have lost their virginity fooled by those qualities. How many people have had their thinking warped by receiving false teaching attractively wrapped. Christ himself was tempted by Satan’s misuse of scripture—-false promises and false reasoning.
Let’s not forget that the enemy of our souls is really a spirit, not flesh and blood. And while the flesh and blood carriers of a false message may be censured, they are not the real enemy.
Kizzie no I was actually piggy backing on the earlier in the day post about the fear factor the “bishop” referenced in her lecture.
So here is a snippet of the Resist movement in some “churches”….seriously? I just saw this on David Harris Jr’s broadcast….he handled this well in his commentary. Harris is the real deal….
Debra – My mention of her voice and demeanor was only in reference to those, like my friend on Facebook, who have said that she was being arrogant and lecturing or whatnot. I can’t think of the exact words that have been used, but the gist was that she was speaking in a harsh tone of voice, not the softer voice that she did use.
She was obviously lecturing. She did it when the cameras were on and when she had the upper hand, being in the pulpit. The assumption given was that Trump is the one being cruel. It was not a debate, since that was not the forum. Whether she said it in a soft voice or not is pretty irrelevant to me. Although, I suppose if you say she was flailing and screaming, you would be lying or exaggerating.
Mother Teresa had no fear of telling President Clinton that the unborn need to be protected and she would take them. That was not in church, however. I thought it was great.
I am kind of fascinated that the same people who seem to hate anyone mentioning politics in church, don’t mind them being brought up by this bishop. It was political even if it wasn’t couched that way.
As far as things Trump does, I don’t think anyone here upholds and believes everything he does is right. I may be mistaken, I suppose. One of the negative things about him being elected (for me) is having to listen to him for 4 years. He doesn’t know when to be quiet and can sound quite immature. However, he holds no monopoly on that among politicians. The media ignores a lot of what others say, which is also unkind, mean and immature.
I am not sure we will ever have statesmen again. One can only hope and pray.
Kathaleena, it’s not a church I’d go to, which I think I’ve said before.
Liberal churches have long addressed politics from the pulpit. Conservative churches, some of them, now have chosen to join that trend (which I hope doesn’t stay around long). But politics-from-the-pulpit is not new. But I think Kizzie is correct (based on the only clips any of us have seen, I haven’t seen the entire sermon anywhere). The tone was soft, the words few. The request was for kindness toward people, it was not a request or lecture to openly to endorse gay behavior or illegal immigration.
I understand objections to it, but maybe it’s received more discussion and attention than it deserved?
I agree with you on hoping God will raise up a statesman sometime in the future who could lead our nation. Would we still recognize someone like that?
“The media” is a very broad category and now includes the Wild West of social media — thinking here of X where pretty much anything goes — along with numerous regular outlets, mainstream and not-so-mainstream. From Fox News to CNBC there are outlets pretty much for every niche political view if that’s what one is looking for. I find good things to watch on Fox News, but some of Fox’s other programs (the more opinionated ones) I generally choose not to watch, at least not often (same would go for a liberal outlet).
I like news to be news, with journalistic standards that have been in place for a long time, not prone to following partisan trends on either side. Give me both or all sides of an issue, please. It’s still available, but needs to be searched out. And it too often has been drowned out by the likes of social media, sadly.
She is an activist of course her aim is for all to acquiesce to her liberal non biblical support for LGBTQ…..from her church denomination website:
To that end, Bishop Budde is an advocate and organizer in support of justice concerns, including racial equity, gun violence prevention, immigration reform, the full inclusion of LGBTQ+ persons, and the care of creation.
Her stance on illegal immigration saying most are nice people cleaning up after Americans is a clear call to leave them alone and let them stay. She definitely had and has her agenda.
Wandering Views 
Bishop asks Trump to “have mercy” on immigrants and gay peopleHow should we see this issue through the lens of Scripture?
by Dr. Jim Denison
Washington National Cathedral in Washington, D.C. By SergeyNovikov/stock.adobe.com.
The Presidential Inaugural Prayer Service is a tradition that stretches back to 1933 and the inauguration of Franklin Delano Roosevelt. The service is held at the Washington National Cathedral, the second-largest church building in the US. The cathedral is the seat of the Presiding Bishop of the Episcopal Church and the bishop of the Diocese of Washington. Since 2011, the latter role has been held by Bishop Mariann Edgar Budde, the first woman to serve in this position.
In her sermon during this year’s service on Tuesday, the bishop made a direct appeal to President Trump: “I ask you to have mercy upon the people in our country who are scared now. There are gay, lesbian, and transgender children in Democratic, Republican, and independent families, some who fear for their lives.”
Then she spoke to the issue of illegal immigration and deportation:
The people who pick our crops and clean our office buildings; who labor in poultry farms and meat packing plants; who wash the dishes after we eat in restaurants and work the night shifts in hospitals, they—they may not be citizens or have the proper documentation. But the vast majority of immigrants are not criminals. They pay taxes and are good neighbors.
Toward the end of her sermon, she said:
I ask you to have mercy, Mr. President, on those in our communities whose children fear that their parents will be taken away, and that you help those who are fleeing war zones and persecution in their own lands to find compassion and welcome here. Our God teaches us that we are to be merciful to the stranger, for we were all once strangers in this land.
“To do justice, and to love kindness”
The bishop has long been a strong critic of Mr. Trump. He responded in turn after the service, calling her “a Radical Left hard line Trump hater” who “brought her church into the world of politics in a very ungracious way.” He added, “She failed to mention the large number of illegal migrants that came into our country and killed people. Many were deposited from jails and mental institutions. It is a giant crime wave that is taking place in the USA.”
How should we see this issue through the lens of Scripture?
As I note in my book, The State of Our Nation: 7 Critical Issues, illegal immigration is a complex issue. Scripture teaches, “You shall not wrong a sojourner or oppress him, for you were sojourners in the land of Egypt” (Exodus 22:21). The Bible consistently calls us to care for immigrants (cf. Leviticus 19:33–34; Deuteronomy 10:18–19; 24:19–22; Ezekiel 47:21–23; Zechariah 7:10; Malachi 3:5; Hebrews 13:2; Matthew 25:35). And we are told that God loves all of us, regardless of our place of origin (Galatians 3:26–29).
At the same time, immigrants or sojourners in the Bible are not in their countries illegally. Immigrants are to obey the law and customs of the land (Isaiah 56:6–7) and to assimilate into the culture of their host country (Deuteronomy 5:14; 16:9–15). They are not to break the law, no matter how difficult their circumstances (Proverbs 6:30–31).
In addition, the Bible consistently affirms the importance of border security: “When the Most High gave to the nations their inheritance, when he divided mankind, he fixed the borders of the peoples” (Deuteronomy 32:8). The Promised Land’s borders are delineated in Numbers 34:1–15 and Ezekiel 47:13–23. We are told, “Do not move the ancient landmark that your fathers have set” (Proverbs 22:28).
With regard to LGBTQ persons, Scripture teaches that all people are made in God’s image and likeness (Genesis 1:27a) and that the Father loves each of us as much as he loves his own Son (John 17:23, 26). However, we are also told that “male and female he created them” (Genesis 1: 27b). Marriage in the Bible is clearly a covenant between one man and one woman (Genesis 2:18–25; Ephesians 5:22–33; Colossians 3:18–19). Sexual relations are intended only for men and women within this covenant (Exodus 20:14; Hebrews 13:4; Leviticus 18:22; 20:13; Romans 1:26–27; 1 Corinthians 6:9–11; 1 Timothy 1:8–11).
While Scripture repeatedly calls us to be merciful to others (Luke 6:36; James 2:13; Matthew 5:7), it also calls us to seek justice and to uphold the rule of law (Isaiah 1:17; Amos 5:24; Proverbs 21:15), a role that is especially assigned to governmental leaders (Romans 13:1–7).
Micah 6:8 expresses well the biblical balance we seek: “What does the Lᴏʀᴅ require of you but to do justice, and to love kindness, and to walk humbly with your God?” (my emphases).
“The greatest favor I can do for others”
As you can see, the issues raised by Bishop Budde are complex, both from a biblical perspective and with regard to practical factors and consequences. In fact, I plan to write a website article later today that explores this complexity in greater detail than space permits here.
However, with all due respect to the bishop, rather than challenging the president directly while giving voice to only one side of the debate, I believe she should have taken this opportunity to focus on Jesus and invite those in the Cathedral and around the world to personal faith in him.
She later said the service was intended as a “one-on-one conversation with the president.” But what about everyone else in attendance and those who would hear later about the controversy she had to know would ensue?
I agree with my friend, the Anglican leader David Roseberry, who said the bishop “closed a door” when she “delivered a lecture—aimed not at the congregation, but at a single member in it. The pulpit became a podium, the sanctuary a platform for ethical and political instruction.”
In his view, “The subject of every sermon should always be Jesus Christ and no one else.” He believes the bishop’s message “would better have been said in another place at another moment” and adds: “The sermon was an opportunity—a singular, sacred one—to speak to the hearts of those gathered and to proclaim the gospel of Jesus Christ to those in attendance and around the world.”
Let’s not miss the opportunity to “speak to the hearts” of the people we meet today. We can win debates and lose souls. When we address the issues of our day, we should leverage them to lead to personal faith in Jesus (cf. John 4:19–26). He alone can change the human heart and bring his kingdom “on earth as it is in heaven” (Matthew 6:10).
Paul Little was right:
“Witnessing is that deep-seated conviction that the greatest favor I can do for others is to introduce them to Jesus Christ.”
To whom will you do this “greatest
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https://www.denisonforum.org/daily-article/bishop-asks-trump-to-have-mercy-on-immigrants-and-gay-people/
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“John Eastman has articulated many times the clear argument against birthright citizenship. His argument is straight forward, it rests on history and precedent, and it avoids the absurd result we have today. Here are his basic points: 🧵”
https://x.com/molmccann/status/1882166528705171786?t=9ovHqz9EDmNjOY4p7P-Kbw&s=19
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I smell BS.
https://x.com/DefiyantlyFree/status/1882273465115254946?s=19
“The Democrat ranking member on the armed services committee works with the same law firm where Pete Hegseth’s sister-in-law works. You know the same sister-in-law that signed an affidavit saying that there was abuse in their marriage. You know the same affidavit that the actual ex-wife has denied on the record.”
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Janice, I don’t take issue with much of that @9:50, he hit on good points and I think we all agree that showing mercy on the sojourner and immigrants among us does not preclude upholding the laws of the land which also need to be maintained in terms of our border.
He included some quotes from Trump later that sounded rather mild.
But there were other things the president said in the aftermath that were not so gracious.
“Apart from her inappropriate statements, the service was a very boring and uninspiring one. She is not very good at her job!” he posted after midnight. “She and her church owe the public an apology!” (Truth Social)
–Trump called Budde a “Radical Left hard line Trump hater” on his Truth Social site on Wednesday.–
https://apnews.com/article/trump-episcopal-bishop-budde-sermon-d393ab9df6278d884ba09fb8e679f563
I’m sorry to see this new administration starting out on what may have been a predictable note. The vitriol is not helpful for a nation already so deeply divided (Trump won but not by all that much). With the pardons for virtually all of the Jan. 6 offenders, including those who committed violent acts against police officers and now are feeling empowered, it’s starting off on a note that I don’t see as ending well or helping to move the nation in a more stable direction.
Some things are best left in the “let it go” category while in the heat of the moment. The church service, I think, was one of those.
Trump’s Truth Social statements (posted often in the wee hours and which I only see afterward when they’re quoted elsewhere) don’t portray a picture of a man who is a mature, capable or wise leader.
He has always sounded “off” to me, immature, emotional, too often angry, and always reactive in a way that doesn’t usually make for good national leadership.
I agree with some of the issues he supports. But the man himself and his character continue to give me concern.
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Won’t someone please think of the poor?
Well not me of course, but someone….
https://x.com/paulsperry_/status/1882112281028464747?t=8soefBHKHBZV6ESwYLJEWg&s=19
“While anti-Trump National Cathedral Rev. Mariann Budde claims to champion the poor and decries the “appalling disparity between rich and poor,” property records show she lives in a $2 million+ colonial mansion with 6 bedrooms and 4.5 bathrooms in a leafy DC neighborhood”
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And what part of Trump’s assessment do you disagree with?
Or is this just another of those tone things?
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🙄🙄🙄
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I thought Trump’s comments on the bishop and the service were appropriate given that she used God’s pulpit to inappropriately further the aims of sodomites and child groomers. In fact, the comments were relatively mild. He would not have been wrong to stand up and leave (at least one representative did). But, on balance, I’m glad he didn’t. He showed respect to the church by staying. It was the bishop who was dishonoring in every way.
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AJ? @11:00 — I believe that was already discussed in the previous day.
Meanwhile, another school shooting 😦
~ Two students are dead and one injured after a 17-year-old male student armed with a handgun opened fire in the cafeteria of Antioch High School in Nashville on Wednesday morning.
The student then fatally shot himself, according to the Metro Nashville Police Department.
The shooter, identified as Solomon Henderson by Metro Nashville Police, was a 17-year-old student at the school.
Nashville Police Chief John Drake said during a 2:30 p.m. news conference there are online “materials” that are factoring into the police’s investigation. “As to a motive, we’re looking into that,” Drake said. “There are some materials on the internet that we’re looking at that’s under the investigation.” ~
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“With the pardons for virtually all of the Jan. 6 offenders, including those who committed violent acts against police officers and now are feeling empowered…”
Have any of them made statements to that effect? I doubt anyone who has been through the political/legal wringer the way many of those people have are feeling empowered. Probably relieved, but nothing about those pardons is empowering. Many lost their health, reputations, livelihoods, etc. Things they will never get back. I was glad to see that they were all pardoned or commuted, especially since it was blatantly politically motivated. They served enough jail time and punishment for any crimes. And yes, accepting a pardon does legally mean you are confessing guilt.
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Stop playing around with Islamism | WORLD
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Correction: accepting a pardon “carries an imputation of guilt and acceptance of a confession of it,…” according to Burdick v. United States. Lawyers will argue about it I suppose, but it seems to me a strong “imputation” of guilt.
https://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/236/79/
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Debra, I have seen statements, yes, but I don’t have much time today so carry on.
Hoping/trusting this thread can find a way for respectful and mature disagreement.
AJ?, no, not a tone “thing” — a leadership, wisdom, and stability issue.
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forgot to add maturity as well.
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There seems to be more of a “blanket” motion in the end for the J6 offenders and from clips of Trump I’ve seen that went against earlier pledges he had made not to include those convicted of violent acts (and Vance as well).
If I’m wrong I am willing to be corrected. But I believe the only ones left incarcerated are those who are still mired in their own legal processes, and that’s about 3 people?
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Trump’s new and improved ‘World Map’. :–)
https://babylonbee.com/news/the-babylon-bee-has-obtained-trumps-new-and-improved-world-map
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DJ, I. Believe you are correct concerning the blanket. But he did give his reason: they have already served their time beyond that normally given for said offenses. Sure, the optics would have been better to hold them a tad longer.
Sadly, I am still reading about the many policemen killed by the mob while I am not aware of any killed by the mob. Several suicides and a medical or two.
mumsee
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the woman in the pulpit concern: that seems to be a fairly common thing in leftward leaning churches. Meaning their focus appears to be more on social justice or compassion than on knowing God. And they begin to have more same leaning writings to support their direction and encourage that rather than clear Scripture which also says care for the poor and the widows and the children.
mumsee
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Oops, that was to Janice on the open.
mumsee
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Thanks, Mumsee.
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The real, BBC has a piece on the released and quotes one as saying he is glad Trump is not looking for retribution and moving forward but he (the proud boy) is not holding himself to the same standard. He believes the committee needs jail time.
A lady around here is trying to get her release rescinded. She believes she was participating in criminal activity and should go through the court system.
mumsee
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This is what corruption looks like.
https://x.com/LizMacDonaldFOX/status/1882387973674533062?t=wLEs3OBkR_1hRDe5gSHIdQ&s=19
“The new controversy of Biden’s Energy Secretary Jennifer Granholm at the last minute on Thursday sending more than $15B in Biden’s green energy loans to utilities in her home state of Michigan is a major wake up call to the significant taxpayer abuses in the Biden White House. Many of them are her donors to her gubernatorial campaign. Granholm approved a massive $22.9B in these 11th hour green loans, sending nearly 70% of that to Michigan, the Beacon reports, either feathering her political nest or her future in the private sector. Democrats hammered President Trump when he campaigned on draining the swamp in 2016. Nancy Pelosi and Democrats pushed back hard to impeach him on one of 85 targets they launched. This also defies the energy department Inspector General who told Granholm to stop the conflicts of interest in these $400B slush funds. This highlights too a government abuse of power sending hundreds of billions of dollars in taxpayer money out the door that gets recycled as campaign donations. This is one of the most underreported stories out there. Whose back is getting scratched and for how much? “
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It’s almost like they have an agenda here.. 🤔
https://x.com/mrddmia/status/1882456870344069468?t=agjI98ApqRuJcIsNFilryw&s=19
“New York Times when peddling abortions:
“Fetus”
New York Times when peddling illegal immigration:
“Unborn Child””
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I think the police union isn’t smiling on any of it. Interesting that at least one woman (@2:28) thinks she should serve her time.
And a few have come forward now expressing personal regret about their participation or that they showed up only to see what unfolded.
I haven’t looked in on Babylon Bee in quite a while, they seemed to lose their funny-edge in my mind — or maybe it just got old, tired, or too political.
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Curious how many of the Biden pardoned are trying to get it taken back.
mumsee
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“Trump is expected to pardon 10 pro-life activists persecuted by the Biden DOJ and imprisoned under the FACE Act:
Lauren Handy (57 months in prison)
John Hinshaw (21 months)
Jonathan Darnell (34 months)
Herb Geraghty (27 months)
Jean Marshall (24 months)
Joan Bell (27 months)
Paulette Harlow (24 months)
Bevelyn Williams (41 months)
Heather Idoni (24 months)
Calvin Zastro (6 months)
Tomorrow will be the 52nd annual March for Life in D.C.
The most pro-life president in history is about to deliver again.”
https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1882477411495018916?t=t1V9SywNAWwTtsd4Z6nqGA&s=19
Establishment shills have only ever given lip service. Once again, Trump delivers on his promises.
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The first post is probably the best conservative Christian analysis I’ve read on the bishop’s words. However, I do think in the context of an inauguration prayer service, a direct message to the incoming president and admin is appropriate. For many on the left, a pastor spoke on mercy and compassion using Jesus’s words and the Christian right and Trump were upset — on the surface level, this speaks volumes to people.
Imagine the situation in reverse from your perspective. Biden in a Catholic church forced to listen to a pro-life sermon. I don’t think anyone here would argue against the message nor its directness. And I can imagine the criticism if Biden walked out.
Trump’s posture and social media posts reveal immaturity and disrespect for the institution if not the church. But this is par for the course for him in almost any setting.
hrw
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I have to give the lady in Idaho credit — I committed a criminal offence and I should pay the penalty. Unlike the post I came across where a man thanks Trump for the pardon and then says he’s off to buy some “motherfxxkin” guns. I suppose he’s celebrating the fact he can buy guns again as he’s no longer a convicted felon but it comes across wrong.
mumsee — I believe there’s three prisoners on federal death row who want to turn the commuted sentence down as they are still appealing their conviction
hrw
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Almost all of the Americas have birthright citizenship — it makes sense for immigrant based countries. Australia, NZ and western Europe also have birthright citizenship but with restrictions.
X links that lead to threads are impossible to follow without an account. I’d be interested in how someone argues against the 14th Amendment and over 100 years of judicial tradition.
The countries with restrictions usually want at least one parent to be a legal resident of a certain time limit or the child has to wait until 18, refugees or migrants may be treated differently than legal immigrants, etc. Instead of an executive order, this might be the way forward for those who want to limit birth right citizenship — might be easier to square with the 14th Amendment.
hrw
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DJ, after I posted I did see one video of proud boys being very exuberant upon their release. I can see how certain statements made could be considered as feeling empowered or maybe even justified. That’s unfortunate. But to me it’s not a sufficient reason to withhold a pardon or commutation given the political nature of the “justice” given them. They were not treated like ordinary offenders or like the multitude of rioters just a few months before.
Opinions will vary of course.
Along with you, I am hopeful that this thread can maintain it’s respectful tone, as well as avoid the equally discouraging tone of tiresome preachiness all too often on display.
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HRW, correct, I had forgotten about them, with legitimate reason to be pardoned or stay in and fight. I guess I was wondering about the others, including the ones never charged with anything. Seems like an ugly anchor to put on any innocent friends or family.
mumsee
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Citizenship: I told you about my son, the un citizen. Brought over for adoption from Ethiopia. The adoption failed before completion. They signed him over to us but though we adopted him, we could not get him citizenship. Ethiopia revoked his citizenship when he left to be adopted. He was a boy without a country until the Navy took him in and fast tracked citizenship. Our systems in everything related to federal are very very complicated. I hope that gets improved soon.
mumsee
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https://dailycitizen.focusonthefamily.com/conservative-christians-weary-of-self-righteous-smug-and-destructive-lectures/
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When the birthright citizenship issue was decide decades ago, it was noted that this applied to citizens children, not the children of illegal immigrants. Our govt keeps ignoring this fact. Below is a link with the author of the 14ths commentary on the matter. It was never intended as they pretend it is today.
https://x.com/TXRandy14/status/1882464336146292850?t=1mxRzTdTmaSXNQAS7u-Daw&s=19
“Here’s the truth: the 14th Amendment was never intended to serve as a blank check for illegal immigration.
It was never intended to grant citizenship to the children of people who BROKE our laws to enter this country.
End Birthright Citizenships.”
——
https://x.com/RScottDalton/status/1881719286500397235?t=0d72lpU98WDwFkkVk-AqtQ&s=19
“I wouldn’t be so sure about that. There are solid legal positions arguing that Birthright Citizenship was never intended to be applied to foreign nationals visiting the country. From the author of the 14th Amendment:”
—-
“This will not, of course, include persons born in the United States who are foreigners, aliens….”
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“This is your reminder that basically no one for the first 100 years after the 14th Amendment’s ratification thought that it mandated birthright citizenship for the U.S.-born children of illegal or nonimmigrant aliens.static.”
heritage.org/legal-and-judi…
https://x.com/AmySwearer/status/1881727014564213055?t=09i8_f5uGfbiyKsP9ky-2g&s=19
—-
This is the link to Heritage’s analysis of the issue.
https://t.co/C3fPCAeXaq
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People need to educate themselves on just what type of un-American garbage these Jan6 “trials” were. Read it, or continue to pretend you’re ignorant of what really happened so your wrong opinion is fine. It’s not.
https://x.com/DefiyantlyFree/status/1882268997606945260?t=ABloFUhgWfo863ocTU8bYw&s=19
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“Thank you again for your generous words and yes, this is what happened in nearly every case. Some are worse—judges deny defense motions to enter exculpatory video into evidence, deny defense motions for witnesses who could describe police excessive force or use of govt agents, etc.”
https://x.com/julie_kelly2/status/1882427201137574267?t=8XUvZUNNCtfJQEgvsmB-ww&s=19
—-‘
“Thank you for looking into what they did to us.
In my sentencing the govt. prosecutor and FBI agent lied to the judge and said I wore body armor to the Capitol and was prepared for “political violence”, just so the judge would add more prison time to my sentence.
Both statements were complete lies and that knew it.
Unconscionable.”
https://x.com/rallynate/status/1882418023836815674?t=ULN6HTJaUGjTHoHU3NqasA&s=19
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“I know the DOJ online database is offensive to the defendants because it seems like some registry but it helped me to understand that what i was hearing about the prosecutions was real….it was not an exaggeration. The charges for the overwhelming majority WERE misdemeanors..parading or trespass…things that have happened many times in that building over the years and continue to happen. Yet those instances were handled like….misdemeanors…fines or dismissals but the DOJ Prosecutors and Judges AND MEDIA were not going to allow that to happen. It was a project..a conspiracy. Looking at other protests like the May 29, 2020 organized attempt to breach the WH WITH the President in residence with serious injuries to over 100 Officers or Secret Service was handled completely differently. And I knew like we all knew…this was POLITICAL persecution..not law enforcement, not justice. That J6 committee was an exercise in tyranny meant to destroy Donald Trump and his supporters and the Conservative movement.
The effort failed…..but the carnage done to the J6 victims is a terrible scourge on the Justice system and the nation but TOO large a percentage of the Country will not acknowledge that. The Dems and media will continue the Psy Op. Pardons are a start…a select committee to examine the J6 committee will be welcome but the real test of Justice must come from Civil Judgements and a VERY Public lawsuit to pound home the crimes committed against J6’ers by our own Government”
https://x.com/GuyRochford/status/1882413906305438047?t=1N9EGMkU-AHccjIv_UHpkA&s=19
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In one of his comments, HRW writes, ” For many on the left, a pastor spoke on mercy and compassion using Jesus’s words and the Christian right and Trump were upset — on the surface level, this speaks volumes to people.”
Yeah, coming out against someone urging mercy does not look or sound good. One Christian friend of a friend on Facebook called her a demon. Another called her despicable and hateful.
I watched that part of the video. Although I do not agree with her religious stance, I thought that her voice sounded calm and had a pleading quality to it.
As for her remark about some people being afraid, she is right about that. Whether or not that fear is justified, it is there.
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So over half of our legal citizens want deportations of invaders. They are tired of Americans providing for those here illegally.
A rally held in Denver of illegal invaders complaining about how scared they are. “A big chunk of people see me as an animal” is manipulation at its finest.
No Virginia there is no Santa Claus. Come here legally with means to be a productive legal citizen of this country.
A sooth sayer calling for mercy while wearing a cleric collar doesn’t persuade me. Her activist life contrary to biblical direction falls flat. Of course believers taking a stand against such feel the wrath of pacifists and those bent on finding fault with those taking a stand against those demanding acceptance. So open your door to someone as they demand you provide everything for them. That’s not how this works.
Joseph said mass deportations would have detrimental consequences for Colorado families.
“Mass deportations will have a profound impact on our children and families,” said Joseph.
Though Trump plans to focus on criminals initially, some of his supporters said they would like to see all undocumented immigrants deported.
A recent New York Times poll found 55% of Americans would support deporting all undocumented immigrants.
“I think that’s really regrettable that this man has been able to pull the wool over Americans’ eyes, and now a big chunk of people see me as an animal, as a threat when I am just here trying to invest my talents in this country,” said Solano-Cordova.
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It’s easy to get caught up in the political turmoil (and not always healthy for our own Christian walk), especially more recently.
I keep up but (purposely) not in a deep-dive, obsessive or emotional way (or at least I try) with the political arguments and divisions of the day.
I tend to be conservative but also with some centrist leanings so my kind of “politics” aren’t very popular with anyone right now. I’m definitely on the outside looking in.
And that’s fine, I’ve pretty much gotten “over” the rough-and-tumble, ugly side of politics through the years as my perspectives have changed and as I’ve also realized it’s not that spiritually or emotionally healthy (for me).
We’re in a difficult, over-heated political climate right now and I guess I think a certain amount of detachment is maybe healthy.
I know I’ve been asked this question before (and I’ve answered it) so I’ll ask it of others who are on the “other side” if you will: Is there anything about Trump that concerns you? Any positions he takes or statements he makes that you might find yourself in disagreement with (even while still supporting him generally)?
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NJ – Is your comment, which includes this: “A rally held in Denver of illegal invaders complaining about how scared they are. . .” related to my comment which included this: “As for her remark about some people being afraid, she is right about that. Whether or not that fear is justified, it is there”?
In case it is, let me clarify that I was referring to people in the LGBTQ+ “community”. They are afraid that the Trump administration is going to be harmful to them in one way or another.
But it has been a couple days since I heard that snippet from the woman’s sermon/speech, so maybe I’ve forgotten whom she was referring to in that part about people being scared.
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Debra @3:58 – “tiresome preachiness all too often on display.”
Hoping you’re not referring to people here (perhaps it was the minister or others in the “news cycle” you were referring to?). I think we’re all trying to just speak clearly. I understand that we will simply disagree on some (or many) things. I’m trying to be careful, and I’m hoping people can try to listen to what others are saying, but simply agree to disagree sometimes, then say their piece (peacefully).
We live in a very divided and even angry political culture right now. None of this is easy for any of us.
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Speaking of Trump’s stance being disrespectful, I disagree. I consider it to be his listening stance. He is focused on what the individual is saying, not on the cameras or on people’s opinion. You can see it when he is talking to dignitaries, news media, people in mourning, etc. And afterwords it is clear he actually heard the individual and was able to have a coherent two way conversation, and the individual feels valued.
Watching others, who may look more attentive or respectful, they often appear to be trying to come up with their next words while not listening.
mumsee
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“I thought that her voice sounded calm and had a pleading quality to it.”
And thus are many seduced. I wonder how many teenagers have lost their virginity fooled by those qualities. How many people have had their thinking warped by receiving false teaching attractively wrapped. Christ himself was tempted by Satan’s misuse of scripture—-false promises and false reasoning.
Let’s not forget that the enemy of our souls is really a spirit, not flesh and blood. And while the flesh and blood carriers of a false message may be censured, they are not the real enemy.
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Kizzie no I was actually piggy backing on the earlier in the day post about the fear factor the “bishop” referenced in her lecture.
So here is a snippet of the Resist movement in some “churches”….seriously? I just saw this on David Harris Jr’s broadcast….he handled this well in his commentary. Harris is the real deal….
https://arktimes.com/arkansas-blog/2025/01/19/little-rock-priest-calls-for-resistance-to-trump-in-fiery-sermon
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That was me
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Amen, Debra.
mumsee
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Debra – My mention of her voice and demeanor was only in reference to those, like my friend on Facebook, who have said that she was being arrogant and lecturing or whatnot. I can’t think of the exact words that have been used, but the gist was that she was speaking in a harsh tone of voice, not the softer voice that she did use.
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She was obviously lecturing. She did it when the cameras were on and when she had the upper hand, being in the pulpit. The assumption given was that Trump is the one being cruel. It was not a debate, since that was not the forum. Whether she said it in a soft voice or not is pretty irrelevant to me. Although, I suppose if you say she was flailing and screaming, you would be lying or exaggerating.
Mother Teresa had no fear of telling President Clinton that the unborn need to be protected and she would take them. That was not in church, however. I thought it was great.
I am kind of fascinated that the same people who seem to hate anyone mentioning politics in church, don’t mind them being brought up by this bishop. It was political even if it wasn’t couched that way.
As far as things Trump does, I don’t think anyone here upholds and believes everything he does is right. I may be mistaken, I suppose. One of the negative things about him being elected (for me) is having to listen to him for 4 years. He doesn’t know when to be quiet and can sound quite immature. However, he holds no monopoly on that among politicians. The media ignores a lot of what others say, which is also unkind, mean and immature.
I am not sure we will ever have statesmen again. One can only hope and pray.
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Kathaleena, it’s not a church I’d go to, which I think I’ve said before.
Liberal churches have long addressed politics from the pulpit. Conservative churches, some of them, now have chosen to join that trend (which I hope doesn’t stay around long). But politics-from-the-pulpit is not new. But I think Kizzie is correct (based on the only clips any of us have seen, I haven’t seen the entire sermon anywhere). The tone was soft, the words few. The request was for kindness toward people, it was not a request or lecture to openly to endorse gay behavior or illegal immigration.
I understand objections to it, but maybe it’s received more discussion and attention than it deserved?
I agree with you on hoping God will raise up a statesman sometime in the future who could lead our nation. Would we still recognize someone like that?
“The media” is a very broad category and now includes the Wild West of social media — thinking here of X where pretty much anything goes — along with numerous regular outlets, mainstream and not-so-mainstream. From Fox News to CNBC there are outlets pretty much for every niche political view if that’s what one is looking for. I find good things to watch on Fox News, but some of Fox’s other programs (the more opinionated ones) I generally choose not to watch, at least not often (same would go for a liberal outlet).
I like news to be news, with journalistic standards that have been in place for a long time, not prone to following partisan trends on either side. Give me both or all sides of an issue, please. It’s still available, but needs to be searched out. And it too often has been drowned out by the likes of social media, sadly.
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She is an activist of course her aim is for all to acquiesce to her liberal non biblical support for LGBTQ…..from her church denomination website:
To that end, Bishop Budde is an advocate and organizer in support of justice concerns, including racial equity, gun violence prevention, immigration reform, the full inclusion of LGBTQ+ persons, and the care of creation.
Her stance on illegal immigration saying most are nice people cleaning up after Americans is a clear call to leave them alone and let them stay. She definitely had and has her agenda.
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