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Our Daily Thread 10-12-12

Good Morning!

What should we talk about today?

Quote of the Day

“The media love coarse debate because coarse debate drives  ratings and ratings generate profits. Unless the TV producer happens to be  William Shakespeare, an argument is more interesting than a soliloquy – and  there will never be a shortage of people willing to argue on TV.”

John  Sununu

51 thoughts on “Our Daily Thread 10-12-12”

  6. It’s not over yet O’s fans. But for somebody, it will be today. I hope it’s the O’s. Trying to kill our pitcher was most uncool though, throwin a bat at him and all.

    🙂

    Either way, whoever wins it is my odds on favorite to win it all. They’ve both shown they have the best pitching.

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  9. Good Morning, Y’all!

    Still gonna root for the Tigers. Can’t stand the Nats…division rivals and all. Bet the Bravos could have eliminated them already…but someone had to fiddle with the plan…(I know…sour grapes!)

    Hope all have a blessed day!

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  11. Photoguy,

    Ah yes, the standard response of someone who’s team’s season is over, or is already out of the playoffs. You sound like my buddy Keith, the Cleveland Indians fan. His football season ends in 2 weeks. It’s a short season for Browns fans too.

    🙂

    C’mon, fess up, which team?

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  12. Started to dislike the Nats when they decided to put San Diego’s own Stephen Strasburg out of commission. So, I’m cheering for the Os.

    Who decided football season should start before baseball season had ended?

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  14. Sigh. I’ve been writing obituary stories most of this week, with possibly a 3rd coming today. The story yesterday was on our former LA school board member who died very unexpectedly — I’d just seen him Monday night at a community meeting.

    Having covered the same communities for many years now, it’s always so strange to be writing the obituaries of longtime sources and people whom I’ve interviewed and interacted with through the years.

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  15. Speaking of obits…I saw the strangest thing today. A hearse was parked on the side of the road, no one was in it, but it did have a casket in the back. Seems a bit disrespectful if you ask me.

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  17. Haven’t turned on the heat yet at our house. Yesterday was nice and warm out, which helped warm up the house again, after it had gotten down to mid-60’s a few days earlier. Hopefully it will retain the heat well until we get our furnace replaced.

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  18. Haven’t turned on the heat yet either, mainly because it needs replaced, which will happen Monday.

    Mrs L sent me a scripture verse which we can relate to last night’s “debate”:

    When a wise man has a controversy with a foolish man,
    The foolish man either rages or laughs, and there is no rest.” Proverbs 29:9

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  21. Somehow I’m always happy to be here and away from the media circus we call elections. I was in the U.S. for a month (during both conventions) and got more than enough of the campaign. I need to get my ballot printed out and in the mail.

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  24. It won’t let me use my name. If i try to change it from g2-4e7ed (foe short), it takes away my gravitar. The other one looks better, but I’d still rather have this.
    If I try to change it, it asks me to register.

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  26. AJ: I may have watched a half-dozen baseball games on TV my entire life. Seriously, not a fan of the sport but I could watch a football game everyday.

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  27. Random,

    I know you don’t like terms like Darwinism and Darwinist, but I see them as appropriate. Not because Darwin “started a cult” but because he created a paradigm shift about human origins that undergirds the modern historical narrative. And, contrary to what you keep asserting, the Darwinian paradigm is not empirical science and, by definition, it cannot be. Rather, it’s a presuppositional lens through which empirical evidence is filtered. And since Darwin is its author, then the Darwinist label is both convenient and fitting. I don’t expect you to adopt that terminology, but that doesn’t mean I’ll stop calling it as I see it.

    In any case, you say that Darwinism doesn’t make any claims about moral superiority in one species or anther, and that’s true. Darwinism is inherently amoral. But the view you explained as,

    black people are inferior to white people, lacking in intelligence, moral sense perhaps closer to animals than to human beings, perhaps deserving of the position of slaves than Caucasians.

    is rooted in Social Darwinism–a view that embarrasses modern day scientists, but is, nevertheless, perfectly consistent with, and rooted in a Darwinian paradigm.

    Certainly Darwinism does say that some animals are more intelligent than others, so it’s perfectly acceptable to propose that some races might be more intelligent than others. And morality within Darwinism, as we’ve already discussed, is something entirely different from the traditional definition of morality. Instead of morality as prescriptive, referring to a transcendent standard by which men are judged, rather it’s understood as descriptive of how men are inclined to behave. So by this understanding, how is it illegitimate to propose the view that a particular race of man has a moral sense and an intelligence that’s closer to the beasts than to other men, and that this makes them more fit for slave labor than for freedom? It’s perfectly consistent with an Darwinian evolutionary view. It’s an empirical claim stemming from a naturalistic Darwinian paradigm, not a metaphysical claim.

    You wax on and on, spouting the modernist historical narrative–as if you actually believe that perhaps we’ve never heard or considered it before. You seem somehow unaware that your view is the dominant cultural narrative in which we’ve all been thoroughly immersed from birth so that, for us to hold a contrary view, it’s required from us serious and sober thought, study, and reflection. Your attitude comes across as incredibly condescending obviously to contemporary Christians, but also to the ancient peoples who preceded us. When you talk about such things as a time when we supposedly ” discovered empiricism” (as if the ancients believed in the resurrection of Christ because they weren’t quite clear on the concept of death), that’s condescension rooted in willful ignorance.

    Ultimately it’s the Holy Spirit who’s convinced Christians of our desperate need for the love and forgiveness of this amazing God of whom we preach, but He hasn’t done so independently from the tools of logic and reason. Rather, God has made us in His image, as creatures guided by these tools, among others.

    You say that you come here to test and try our faith, but I often suspect that you actually come here because our very existence and our confidence creates in you a nagging doubt in your faith in your own worldview, and you hope that, by interacting with us, you can convince yourselves that our beliefs can be safely dismissed. I’ll just continue to pray that you fail to find that reassurance here.

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  28. Re: Sports. This is the time of year when all the major sports are going. Baseball ending, football in the middle of the season and the other two are in preseason. Actually, since they (NHL/NBA) have such long post seasons, this is the first third. The regular is the middle third, and the post season is the last third. (But who even pays attention to them?)

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  29. Hi, Ree. If you say the same nonsense 1000 times, it is the same nonsense. If I make the same sensible point 1000 times you will still refuse to accept it. So I guess it comes down to which of us dies or retires from this first. At which point, each of us will cease to exist.

    You may be getting as forgetful as me. You were going to post some titles of books for me to read, ones that Roger Williams might have approved of. I am still waiting for the list.

    I am not an easy person, though I am an old and slow thinker. I am willing to consider reading at least one of them, but only if you agree to a counter-proposal. I will not offer my proposal until I see your list of books. If it shows up in the next couple of months (as I will be out of state for about that time), and if I am alive (as I am getting old, and one never knows about these matters), we can discuss the matter. Unless you’ve forgotten, changed your mind, or who knows what?

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  30. I don’t follow pro sports. I used to watch Redskins football when I lived in Va. I follow the Gamecocks and Boilermakers. But I seldom hear about Boilermakers down here.

    It’s a different world up there. I had forgotten about driving 68 mph on an eight land hwy with cars passing on both sides. Speed limit 55. If you live in a large town you understand it.
    In Hendersonville, it’s equivalent to driving up King St. at 30 mph. The speed limit is 20, but the lights are timed for 30.

    Chas is tired. He left Alexandria at 5:00 a.m. A bit early, but that is the best time to get on I-95 going south.
    I don’t know about other large metro areas, but the DC area is becoming pagan.
    When I joined Boulevard Baptist Church in 1963, they had two morning service.
    The area also had Columbia BC, FBC Annandale, National Gardens BC, Calvary Hill BC, and some others. Bouldevad and FBC Anndndale have merged with attendance about 60. They are talking about merging with Calvary Hill BC. National Gardens is gone. The only Baptist Churches I know to be in the area are Columbia BC and FBC Alexandria; possibly Braddock. Women with head coverings, such as Muslim women wear are common. Not at all to overhear foreign language conversations, not necessarily Spanish.

    It was difficult driving in the area because I thought I knew how to get everywhere. But it has changed so much that what I knew isn’t so anymore. It took me a couple of days to deliberately forget what I knew and follow the signs.

    I’m glad I don’t live there anymore. But you adjust to the traffic immediately.

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  31. I have been on Metro many times. I’m still surprised when I realize that I’m slightly glad when we emerge from underground. I don’t know why.

    If you need a job, go to the DC area. Lots of construction there. And every department store is hiring. Everything up there is expensive.
    But I knew that.

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  32. 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

    The Yankees win!!!!!!!

    🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

    I will now say something nice about the O’s. The Yanks have played them 20 times reg. season and split 10-10. Two runs seperated them 208 to 206. They had played 5 playoff games. The Yanks win it 3 games to 2. Total run seperation for the playoffs, 14 runs to 12.

    I’ve been a Yankee fan for years, 3rd grade, 38 years. Never have I seen a team of ours this good, played so tough by a division rival, and that includes the Red Soxs (spits). Their pitching equaled ours, which is one of our strong suits. I honestly believe if not for the Yanks, the O’s would win it all. I’m impressed.

    Now knock it off and please go back to basement dwelling next year.

    🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

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  34. Chas,
    It wasn’t a ring, it was one of those rubber wristbands. They come in all kinds of colors and often are sold as fundraisers for some cause or other. A lot of people got “Live Strong” wristbands, I don’t know if they were for a fundraiser or not, but related to Armstrong and his winning over cancer and emphasis on health. He was seen as quite a role model – now people are indeed likely to want to throw those wristbands out.

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  36. Chas, I’m with you on D.C. traffic. It was bad 30 years ago and has only gotten worse. I-35 between D/FW and San Antonio is also very bad. On a weekday afternoon, it is like NASCAR. Everyone is going 75-80 with about 10 feet of room between each car. The trip to Lubbock is more relaxing. The last 150 miles is through counties where the county seats all have less than 300 people.

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  37. The yellow bracelets denote Lance Armstrong’s Livestrong foundation which, according to their website, ‘fights to improve the lives of people affected by cancer.’ It has a reputation as a pretty good organization, here’s the site address, if anyone is interested in learning how they use the money they raise:

    http://www.livestrong.org/

    Just for the record, I’ve never particularly been a fan of Mr. Armstrong [or bicycle racing, for that matter], I just happen to know about the bracelets.

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  38. AJ, I wish you could have been with us 3 years ago when we took my wife to New York for her 50th birthday right before Christmas. We went to FAO Schwartz and who was there with his family? C. C. Sabathia. There was no mistaking him for anyone else.

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  39. Chas said,

    I have been on Metro many times. I’m still surprised when I realize that I’m slightly glad when we emerge from underground. I don’t know why.

    Glorying in the foreshadowing of the coming resurrection, perhaps?

    🙂

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  40. I’ve just gotten home from work and it is around 11:00 pm. That’s the way it is in a tax prep office near the extension deadline. I am still trying to finish the article I am working on. It seems there are always changes that can be made to make writing just a bit better.

    There has not been time to read the blog but I wanted to drop in and say hello even though it is late and I don’t know if anyone will see my post. I hope things are going okay for Kim and Paula on their new jobs.

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  41. Hey Janice, you’re definitely right about the writing — you can tinker with it forever and ever, which is a great luxury (and one I usually don’t get too often!). What’s the article about?

    I had 3 stories to write today, which is a lot typically — one on the skatepark being planned, another on the eight developers who have applied for a 30-acre parcel to redevelop (the old Ports O’ Call, if that means anything to anyone other than Michelle!), and yet another obit story 0n “the chantey guy,” a bearded fellow who for more than 40 years has been one of our most iconic street performers, singing sea chanteys and playing his banjo (and always wearing a striped pirate/sailor T-shirt w/bell bottoms & a hat) at special events — but also just on random waterfront street corners, at tall ship festivals, at the farmer’s market, etc. 🙂

    He really will be missed, strange to think of the town without him somehow. Originally came here from NJ (I talked with his sister, a NY social worker, today).

    Anyway, I’m beat.

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  44. Random says,

    If you say the same nonsense 1000 times, it is the same nonsense. If I make the same sensible point 1000 times you will still refuse to accept it. </blockquote?

    Perhaps so, but the fact that when I say my "nonsense" I go into painstaking detail explaining the logic and reasoning behind it, while your "sensible points" are never backed up or defended with any kind of logic–just your insistence that you obviously make sense and that Christian's don't. So pardon me if I'm not persuaded.

    In regard to the writings I said I'd recommend, I didn't forget, but I wasn't quite convinced that you were genuinely interested, so I figured I'd wait until you clearly confirmed that you were before I recommended anything.

    The mention of Roger Williams approving of certain writings was specifically referring to the affirmation of God both willing and not willing all things that come to pass. Since Williams was a Calvinist, and since I was alluding to Calvinist exegesis of Scripture, that's why I said he'd approve. I'll look around for something that explains this idea but, honestly, I don't expect that to be convincing to you who already rejects Scripture a priori. But I just thought you might be curious about the Biblical answer to your question, as well as some insight into the theology of your hero. But I’ve also suggested in previous discussions that you might want to read some challenges to your modernist paradigm, so let me give a little thought to which titles I think might be helpful and I’ll get back to you on that. Maybe tomorrow.

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  47. Facebook is so awesome. “Littlefoot.” 🙂 Someone just recommended that people there read a story by me, mistaking my real name (littlejohn) for Littlefoot. 🙂 Which I really kind of like.

    “Littlefoot” is such a cool name.

    I’m also often called “Lightfoot.”

    And I’m frequently asked if I’m American Indian.

    No wonder.

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  49. Does England exist? I’ve never been there, but my daughter spent a year studying there, and she’s never told me a lie, so I’m inclined to believe her. Did Roger Williams exist? There are lots of books about him (even though we don’t have any videos or recordings of him preaching) or any photographs of him, so I am inclinced to believe in him.

    There are lots and lots of books about Christ at the church of my sort of evangelical friends. And I suspect that Christ existed, but you know the rest. (If not, go back and read more of my comments to exercise you denial muscles. Mine are quite strong.)

    If any of this is true, Christianity is weakening. In Roger Williams’ day, Catholics were quite willing to kill Protestants and Protestants were almost as willing to kill Catholics. Now that’s what I call practicing what you preach!

    I thought about counting the religious comments in the current WV discussion. I got bored with trying to be precise, but at least half didn’t even make an effort, and half of the other half did no more than make a superficial pass at being religious.

    On our island there are at least 30 or 40 churches, and some of them are really serious and fill up on Sunday, or Saturday, or whatever day they think God wants to hear you pray to Him. On the other hand, there are quite a few atheists, but very few of them gather in groups and we don’t even have one building. About the most I’ve ever had at one of my sessions is about a dozen. But some keep coming, and at least two people are helping keep things running, so if I croak tomorrow the non-church without a building might keep going for a while. And I’m sure your church would keep going if your minister died or lost faith or ran away. I mean, it would be a shame if Christ finally remembered to return and found nobody waiting for him.

    So as Christianity has faded to the point that no Christians kill each other any more and no atheists persecute Christians any more, what’s next on the program? Is the Devil going to conquer everything after all? And then what?

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  50. So correct me if I’m wrong, but one of your arguments for why you believe Christianity is “weakening” is because Christians say lots of things that aren’t “religious”?

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    • In the good old days (Roger Williams — 1600s), Christians often demonstrated how devout they were by killing each other, often in very inventive and creative ways. As this is a family blog (and all of you wussies and sissies would be offended, irritated, and ignore me), I am not posting detailed descriptions about how Catholics killed Protestants and about how Protestants killed Catholics in Roger William’s times. Although Roger was a tough dude and willing to go to war if the times got really bad (mostly involving King Philip’s War), he mostly was a man of peace and genuinely lived up to his ideals of living in peace. He was a pretty good businessman, as well. Perhaps he might have voted for Romney, but I think if Mormonism had been invented/revealed in his time, he would have had a terrible choking fit as he tried to take a swig of hard cider.

      Anyway, to answer your question quite explicitly, when Christianity was “strong” it killed enemies (whether Muslims, wrongly believing Christians, and, of course, atheists) with hardly a moment’s hesitation. Now, some of the weak Christians here, besides grieving over pets, almost never kill anyone. What kind of Christianity is it that doesn’t kill people? You call that STRONG Christianity?

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