“Where’s the media scrutiny when millions in “digital consulting” fees funnel directly to the residence of Loren Merchan, the daughter of highly conflicted Judge Juan Merchan? Democrat politicians like Kathy Hochul, Hakeem Jeffries, Adam Schiff, and Dan Goldman seem to be writing hefty checks with alarming frequency to this seemingly inconspicuous Virginia home. As investigative journalist @LauraLoomer has highlighted, we’re talking sums that dwarf industry standards for digital consulting. Coincidence? Or a cover for a deeper, more disturbing exchange?
This judge, who was just “randomly assigned” to Steve Bannon’s upcoming trial, has a history of handling high-profile cases involving President Trump’s associates. President Trump’s attorney Alina Habba says, “Judge Merchan has somehow, randomly selected, had Steve Bannon’s case, had Allen Weisselberg’s case … somehow, he randomly also gets Donald Trump. That’s not the way the system works. You assign a case randomly. But in the new America, under the Biden Regime, we are witnessing the politicization of all our judicial systems.”
Are we witnessing a blatant pay-for-play, buying judicial favoritism in broad daylight? The Biden Regime’s America seems to be shaping a new norm, one where the law bends and the judiciary is auctioned to the highest bidder. Demand answers. Our republic deserves transparency, not under-the-table transactions masked as mundane consulting fees.”
“Alina Habba: “Judge Merchan…has somehow randomly selected had Steve Bannon’s case, had Allen Weisselberg’s case…somehow, he randomly also gets Donald Trump. That’s not the way the system works. You assign a case randomly…but in the new America, under the Biden Regime, we are sitting here in a politicization of all our judicial systems.””
“Why do finance records show that Democrat politicians like Kathy Hochul, Hakeem Jeffries, Adam Schiff, and Dan Goldman are sending millions of dollars to the Virginia home address of Loren Merchan, daughter of highly conflicted judge Juan Merchan, for supposed “digital consulting”? As @LauraLoomer has reported, the enormous sums being sent to Loren’s home are far outside the norm for regular “digital consulting.” What’s going on? Is this some kind of pay-for-play scheme for rigged judicial rulings from Judge Merchan? This judge, who was just “randomly assigned” to Steve Bannon’s upcoming trial, has a history of handling high-profile cases involving President Trump’s associates. President Trump’s attorney Alina Habba says, “Judge Merchan has somehow, randomly selected, had Steve Bannon’s case, had Allen Weisselberg’s case … somehow, he randomly also gets Donald Trump. That’s not the way the system works. You assign a case randomly. But in the new America, under the Biden Regime, we are witnessing the politicization of all our judicial systems.””
“Update on the Biden admin’s Gaza pier to nowhere: Parts of it have broken free and washed up in Israel. And virtually all of the aid that was delivered was stolen by Hamas. A $320M fleecing of the US taxpayer. There should be hearings.”
“Merchan just delivered the coup de grace instruction. He said that there is no need to agree on what occurred. They can disagree on what the crime was among the three choices. Thus, this means that they could split 4-4-4 and he will still treat them as unanimous…”
Recently, there was a brief discussion about how we express our views on this thread. The idea that as Christians, we should be more respectful in our discourse was countered with “Politics is a contact sport”, or similar wording.
Sometime within the past couple of days, I came across this piece about how Christians should engage in online discussions, wrapping up with:
“. . . But it makes no sense when Christians play right into the playbook of the Dark Laws of Online Engagement. We are called to be the light, not play in the dark. Pushing back against online darkness means refusing to play by the rules of engagement that the algorithms set for us. We need new laws of online engagement. Laws that reveal the True Law of the universe—the Law of Love.”
The nation is in a rather scary time for all kinds of reasons but despite all of that, it matters how we in the church speak to and about others.
It’s one thing for us to miss the mark and fall into arguing and failing to love our neighbor and all of those made in God’s image (I’ve been guilty).
To deliberately do so — and then to defend it which is what we are all tempted to do — is just missing the point of the faith we claim we live by. We are called to be different.
This is a hard time in our nation. Ugly emotions have taken over much of our discourse and online platforms have set much of our political discourse on fire (James 3:6 – And the tongue is a fire, a world of unrighteousness. The tongue is set among our members, staining the whole body, setting on fire the entire course of life, and set on fire by hell.).
Meanwhile, times and positions on early voting have changed this time around, apparently:
The GOP Tries a Different Tune on Early and Mail-in Voting
GREENSBORO, N.C.—Lara Trump, the co-chair of the Republican National Committee, continued her push to promote mail-in and early voting to a gathering of party activists in her home state of North Carolina last weekend, encouraging Republicans to “bank” their vote and make the margins in the fall’s presidential election “too big to rig.”
“Any way you can vote and as early as you can vote, get your vote banked,” Trump said at a Friday night dinner during the North Carolina Republican Party’s annual convention. “… We have to make it too big to rig in this election cycle.” …
We have voted early for a number of years. It makes sense to do so. Many Republicans are older. Why risk not feeling up to going out to vote on that one final day?
I don’t have a problem with how people express themselves on the blog. I have a problem with people supporting the killing of other people who have not harmed them ( both Democrats and Republicans ).
Surely Christians of all people, should have a default of peacefulness unless absolutely necessary. Sadly, this is not the case.
I know many of you may be tired of explaining to unbelievers how a Christian can support Trump. I’m weary of being asked why American Christians, especially Evangelicals, are so war-like and blood thirsty. Saying it’s complicated is a cop-out. It really isn’t that complicated.
Maybe I am sheltered, or am a member of a church that isn’t a “traditional evangelical” denomination or independent body, but I don’t find serious believers to be blood thirsty or loving war. So I suppose I’m asking if that criticism is really fair or not.
War is sin writ large, as CS Lewis once said.
It is a very big example of a fallen world filled with fallen people (all of us).
As for how nations behave, that is a toss up and foreign policy for the U.S. is especially wrought with disagreement.
And … Remember, a lot of people use the term evangelical Christian to describe themselves. Clearly not all of them are.
At our church in corporate worship we pray each week We for peace and that the wars in Ukraine and the Middle East will end (and nothing more than that). War causes unspeakable suffering. So does injustice of other kinds.
And Janice, I think voting early is clearly here to stay. I agree there should be safeguards when it comes to mailings of ballots — it should not be done carelessly or without checking voter rolls.
I now am so used to filling out my ballot and then dropping it at a nearby “Vote Center” (one is always near me and it feels more secure than a box at the park or a mail box). But no more trying to juggle what is typically a busy Election Day work schedule with trying to actually vote myself.
Debra: “Surely Christians of all people, should have a default of peacefulness unless absolutely necessary. Sadly, this is not the case.”
I appreciate that point and suspect most of us do naturally *default* in that manner considering the horrific suffering war brings.
But it also has been said that there are worse evils than war. Those are the situation that become difficult to weigh, when others are suffering and being killed at the hands of wicked governments and it becomes too widespread and glaring to ignore.
Of course the other issues come down to the world being so interconnected – we do not exist in a vacuum so ignoring issues beyond our borders often come our way to haunt and impact us as well.
These aren’t really black and white issues for either believers to view in strict biblical ways — or for nations to navigate amid many complexities and no shortage of unknown consequences. Hindsight, of course, is 20/20. But we don’t have that going into these issues.
We often get it wrong. Sometimes we get it right, even when we tried our best to ignore the inevitable (WWII).
“BREAKING: New FOIA documents reveal that the Department of Justice and FBI uncovered alarming 2020 election ballot fraud in Detroit, Michigan but covered it up
In the emails, a DOJ official says “This allegation, and accompanying photos, is alarming. I would like FBI to look into this please.”
Someone at the Michigan Attorney General’s office also responded to the complaint, “Talked to the FBI on this and it’s not going to be in their lane or ours in terms of apparent criminal actions, but MDOS (Michigan Department of State) may want to call and try and head this off.”
Somehow the two investigative bureaus with real authority to investigate credible allegations decided to pass the buck to the Secretary of State, who would’ve been a huge reason why the election was so fraudulent in the first place. The corruption is so obvious.”
Is it your “niceness” that prevents you from speaking out about the abuse and politicization of our justice system and govt? Because you never do. Just wondering why that is. Never any righteous indignation. Or is it just because Orange Man Bad, so you’ll excuse it?
“Maybe I am sheltered, or am a member of a church that isn’t a “traditional evangelical” denomination or independent body, but I don’t find serious believers to be blood thirsty or loving war. So I suppose I’m asking if that criticism is really fair or not.”
Our very openly Evangelical Speaker of the House has declared himself a “war Speaker”. There is a huge overlap between neo-conservatives and evangelicals. The support from churches like yours happens in the comfort, safety and anonymity of the voting booth I think.
You’d think logically that those who are totally anti-war, anti-guns, anti-death penalty, etc. would be anti-abortion considering blood of innocents is shed and weapons of mass destruction are used to deplete citizens of a certain race, but somehow there is a huge blind spot, a log jammed in the eye, or a brain disconnrct. It seems totally illogical. But here we are.
Not sure what @5:50 refers to (our church being in the comfort, safety and anonymity of the voting booth?).
We’re a conservative Presbyterian church that understands the difference between church and state. As other churches (apparently, so I’ve read) pitch headlong into a politicized faith, ours thankfully has resisted.
The world throughout its history has often been in turmoil, nothing new under the sun. Our country — which is quite young, historically speaking — is in a difficult period that is testing our commitment to a democratic form of government in which people of differing backgrounds, races, creeds — and political persuasions — can co-exist. Perhaps it won’t work when all is said and done, but I hope this will be a temporary period.
AJ, I’m not sure whom you’re addressing, probably me as I’m the frequent target here, but how much power do you have in the country via your online activity, do you think? Not much — and that holds true for any of us.
I fail to see how online X’s rants and raves are helping much of anything.
Politics can become so overly important that folks can forget their first calling and first loyalty. It seems to be happening in the US more often than not lately.
I will pray for whomever becomes the next president.
Debra, never heard the term “war speaker.” I was rather dubious about Johnson (I think AJ called him my “boy” once, rather funny) and still don’t have an emotionally-strong “feeling” about him. Time will tell.
He’s got a hard job herding cats, I will say that.
And I’m not trying to “be nice,” my aim is simply to be respectful on this thread – and try to understand where others are coming from while explaining my position.
I follow politics but not nearly as closely as some of you.
I don’t find righteous indignation all that helpful to a discussion — and there already is plenty of that here to cover any lack of it from anyone else. The indignant tone and subject has already been exhaustively posted on most days.
Admittedly, too, I don’t usually trust the source material cited on this thread so unless I have time to research it (which I usually don’t) there’s nothing I can, in good conscience, say — without knowing more.
“You’d think logically that those who are totally anti-war, anti-guns, anti-death penalty, etc. would be anti-abortion”
Janice, I have often thought the same thing. To me there doesn’t seem to be a real pro-life agenda for either party. One has been ok killing people before they’re born, the other after —-both with very little pretext or justification. And more recently Democrats have been all on board with our endless wars.
We went to a Baptist Church for a few years after we moved to the Chattanooga are. Politics was often front and center at the pulpit. I believe I mentioned we had Ted Cruz’s dad “minister” to us when Cruz was running for president. We had Mike Huckabee (who was at least a minister) for 4th of July one year. We had our DC representative show up for those. And the pastor was often overtly political.
We finally couldn’t take it anymore and went back to the denomination I grew up in. The pastor is a wonderful person who is devoted to Christ– well learned and wise beyond his years. However the whole denomination is seeped in the theology of Dispensationalism. As are many, many other evangelical denominations. And that is something we have been struggling to overcome. But at least pastor doesn’t preach politics from the pulpit. Usually.
The death penalty is the “pro-life” exception argued about from the left. And some believers are divided on the death penalty as well.
Guess the question should center on are these issues completely interchangeable in their moral arguments or not (and for believers that has a basis in the Scriptures).
Our church has a tradition (and conviction) of staying clear of politics on Sunday mornings (and, from what I’ve seen, any other time as well). Though as mumsee said, people outside will talk.
We’ve never passed out the “Voter Guides” at our church (so popular with some churches though) and have never (ever) had a political figure speak (this happens frequently in Black churches).
One of the people I sit next to usually, a young man, told me once in one of our ‘outdoor’ discussions that if he ever heard a politician’s name or some kind of ‘endorsement’ from the pulpit, he’d be gone.
Dispensationalism is a whole other issue (we’re not that either).
Never at our church. I wouldn’t sit in one that talks politics from the pulpit. That’s not why I’m there.
You see even partisan people like me can separate church and politics.
Some others should try that. Leave your politics at the door for church, leave your pastor search out of politics. You won’t find one. Its a presidential search. So stop expecting to find one in our 2 party system.
My post was referring to how we treat and communicate with other people, including with our fellow believers. And including on this blog.
But yes, even with people who one might consider “the opposition”, a respectful tone will get through much better than angry bile thrown at their face. That is not the same thing as merely being “nice”. And the Bible doesn’t make a distinction between how we should communicate with “good people” and how we should communicate with “bad people”. (In fact, we were all “bad people” before we found Christ.)
Do you consider DJ and me to be the opposition? Is that why you are rude and dismissive towards us or towards HRW? Refraining from rudeness is not merely being nice, it is effective communication, and it is biblical.
No, I do not excuse what is going on in the government or the justice system. Just because I do not comment on every issue does not mean that I don’t care. (In fact, I don’t comment much at all on many news issues. And as DJ said, “there already is plenty of that here to cover any lack of it from anyone else.”)
Despite my repeatedly saying that I am not a “Never-Trump” (or “Orange Man Bad”) kind of person, you continue to paint me as such. That makes it easy to be dismissive of me and my views.
I agree with what DJ addressed to you in 6:16, and her 6:25 comment.
But you’re right in that it is a dead horse. I almost did not bother sharing that. As one fellow believer to another, that is very sad.
~ … As Christians, how can we learn to disagree well, especially with other Christians?
In 1970, Francis Schaeffer, one of the most astute apologists of the 20th century, published “The Mark of the Christian.” I first read the book about 50 years ago, and it continues to shape how I think about encounters like the one with my friend. It’s a brief book; you can read it in about an hour. Yet it may carry more weight today than at any time in the last half-century because it reminds us of the importance of loving our neighbor and being able to disagree well—vital skills in an increasingly polarized age.
The Mark of the Christian is Schaeffer’s meditation on two passages in John’s Gospel. He begins with John 13:34-35: “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another.By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
Schaeffer marvels at Jesus’s words:
In the midst of the world, in the midst of our present dying culture, Jesus is giving a right to the world. Upon his authority he gives the world the right to judge whether you and I are born-again Christians on the basis of our observable love toward all Christians. . . .
Wandering Views 
The media sucks.
https://x.com/LivePDDave1/status/1795105384291561945?t=RTLs5KbS4Zf2nYLPbLVmpQ&s=19
“Where’s the media scrutiny when millions in “digital consulting” fees funnel directly to the residence of Loren Merchan, the daughter of highly conflicted Judge Juan Merchan? Democrat politicians like Kathy Hochul, Hakeem Jeffries, Adam Schiff, and Dan Goldman seem to be writing hefty checks with alarming frequency to this seemingly inconspicuous Virginia home. As investigative journalist @LauraLoomer has highlighted, we’re talking sums that dwarf industry standards for digital consulting. Coincidence? Or a cover for a deeper, more disturbing exchange?
This judge, who was just “randomly assigned” to Steve Bannon’s upcoming trial, has a history of handling high-profile cases involving President Trump’s associates. President Trump’s attorney Alina Habba says, “Judge Merchan has somehow, randomly selected, had Steve Bannon’s case, had Allen Weisselberg’s case … somehow, he randomly also gets Donald Trump. That’s not the way the system works. You assign a case randomly. But in the new America, under the Biden Regime, we are witnessing the politicization of all our judicial systems.”
Are we witnessing a blatant pay-for-play, buying judicial favoritism in broad daylight? The Biden Regime’s America seems to be shaping a new norm, one where the law bends and the judiciary is auctioned to the highest bidder. Demand answers. Our republic deserves transparency, not under-the-table transactions masked as mundane consulting fees.”
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It’s all totally random… 🙄
https://x.com/Jules31415/status/1793149492419588317?t=ejZEysAJEAMkyv72f0Mi4Q&s=19
“Alina Habba: “Judge Merchan…has somehow randomly selected had Steve Bannon’s case, had Allen Weisselberg’s case…somehow, he randomly also gets Donald Trump. That’s not the way the system works. You assign a case randomly…but in the new America, under the Biden Regime, we are sitting here in a politicization of all our judicial systems.””
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This is how you buy a corrupt judge. It’s the Biden way.
https://x.com/LivePDDave1/status/1794746139952005274?t=Pz_T4-fZHk1EMv_98SzBFQ&s=19
“Why do finance records show that Democrat politicians like Kathy Hochul, Hakeem Jeffries, Adam Schiff, and Dan Goldman are sending millions of dollars to the Virginia home address of Loren Merchan, daughter of highly conflicted judge Juan Merchan, for supposed “digital consulting”? As @LauraLoomer has reported, the enormous sums being sent to Loren’s home are far outside the norm for regular “digital consulting.” What’s going on? Is this some kind of pay-for-play scheme for rigged judicial rulings from Judge Merchan? This judge, who was just “randomly assigned” to Steve Bannon’s upcoming trial, has a history of handling high-profile cases involving President Trump’s associates. President Trump’s attorney Alina Habba says, “Judge Merchan has somehow, randomly selected, had Steve Bannon’s case, had Allen Weisselberg’s case … somehow, he randomly also gets Donald Trump. That’s not the way the system works. You assign a case randomly. But in the new America, under the Biden Regime, we are witnessing the politicization of all our judicial systems.””
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Your tax dollars are hard at work….
Funding terrorism. This is what Biden does best in foreign policy. Enable and fund terrorists.
https://x.com/TheMossadIL/status/1794739374007230783?t=ZISfqISGt0O7TbWngdCZ-w&s=19
“Well, well, well. They followed the money, and look what they found!
$50,000,000 in unaudited US taxpayer money in one month alone went to a pro-terrorist group disguised as a climate change organization.”
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Yet another example.
https://x.com/NoahPollak/status/1794871101530730825?t=o_-GnGP8_2Ka74kIdSGaOw&s=19
“Update on the Biden admin’s Gaza pier to nowhere: Parts of it have broken free and washed up in Israel. And virtually all of the aid that was delivered was stolen by Hamas. A $320M fleecing of the US taxpayer. There should be hearings.”
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Laws? Constitutional rights?
Not in Merchan’s corrupt kangaroo court.
https://x.com/JonathanTurley/status/1795829624502681688?t=llxmPzRTJEVpa484lpN0RA&s=19
“Merchan just delivered the coup de grace instruction. He said that there is no need to agree on what occurred. They can disagree on what the crime was among the three choices. Thus, this means that they could split 4-4-4 and he will still treat them as unanimous…”
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Checked and rechecked, right?
https://x.com/Real_RobN/status/1795268703388647462?t=OcTPrVIjmiDy-Jp3P5RMAA&s=19
“And here is the 2020 election,
GA: +96,000 MAIL IN BALLOTS cast, but no record of ever being returned,
PA: +766,000 MAIL IN BALLOTS cast, just appears out of nowhere,
AZ: +733,000 MAIL IN BALLOTS cast, just vanished into thin air, uncounted for,
MI: +100,000 MAIL IN BALLOTS applications falsified at Gov. Gretchen Whitbag’s own election headquarters,
📝in other words your government was overthrown.”
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Yes, I agree.
and God tells us not to trust in chariots and all.
The nation may be destroyed but He is still King.
mumsee
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😒
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For those who may not have seen: Kevin left comments at the end of yesterday’s news thread earlier today.
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Recently, there was a brief discussion about how we express our views on this thread. The idea that as Christians, we should be more respectful in our discourse was countered with “Politics is a contact sport”, or similar wording.
Sometime within the past couple of days, I came across this piece about how Christians should engage in online discussions, wrapping up with:
“. . . But it makes no sense when Christians play right into the playbook of the Dark Laws of Online Engagement. We are called to be the light, not play in the dark. Pushing back against online darkness means refusing to play by the rules of engagement that the algorithms set for us. We need new laws of online engagement. Laws that reveal the True Law of the universe—the Law of Love.”
https://www.endeavorwithus.com/four-spiritual-laws-of-online-christian-engagement
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Excellently said, thanks Kizzie.
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The nation is in a rather scary time for all kinds of reasons but despite all of that, it matters how we in the church speak to and about others.
It’s one thing for us to miss the mark and fall into arguing and failing to love our neighbor and all of those made in God’s image (I’ve been guilty).
To deliberately do so — and then to defend it which is what we are all tempted to do — is just missing the point of the faith we claim we live by. We are called to be different.
This is a hard time in our nation. Ugly emotions have taken over much of our discourse and online platforms have set much of our political discourse on fire (James 3:6 – And the tongue is a fire, a world of unrighteousness. The tongue is set among our members, staining the whole body, setting on fire the entire course of life, and set on fire by hell.).
Meanwhile, times and positions on early voting have changed this time around, apparently:
The GOP Tries a Different Tune on Early and Mail-in Voting
GREENSBORO, N.C.—Lara Trump, the co-chair of the Republican National Committee, continued her push to promote mail-in and early voting to a gathering of party activists in her home state of North Carolina last weekend, encouraging Republicans to “bank” their vote and make the margins in the fall’s presidential election “too big to rig.”
“Any way you can vote and as early as you can vote, get your vote banked,” Trump said at a Friday night dinner during the North Carolina Republican Party’s annual convention. “… We have to make it too big to rig in this election cycle.” …
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We have voted early for a number of years. It makes sense to do so. Many Republicans are older. Why risk not feeling up to going out to vote on that one final day?
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I don’t have a problem with how people express themselves on the blog. I have a problem with people supporting the killing of other people who have not harmed them ( both Democrats and Republicans ).
Surely Christians of all people, should have a default of peacefulness unless absolutely necessary. Sadly, this is not the case.
I know many of you may be tired of explaining to unbelievers how a Christian can support Trump. I’m weary of being asked why American Christians, especially Evangelicals, are so war-like and blood thirsty. Saying it’s complicated is a cop-out. It really isn’t that complicated.
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Maybe I am sheltered, or am a member of a church that isn’t a “traditional evangelical” denomination or independent body, but I don’t find serious believers to be blood thirsty or loving war. So I suppose I’m asking if that criticism is really fair or not.
War is sin writ large, as CS Lewis once said.
It is a very big example of a fallen world filled with fallen people (all of us).
As for how nations behave, that is a toss up and foreign policy for the U.S. is especially wrought with disagreement.
And … Remember, a lot of people use the term evangelical Christian to describe themselves. Clearly not all of them are.
At our church in corporate worship we pray each week We for peace and that the wars in Ukraine and the Middle East will end (and nothing more than that). War causes unspeakable suffering. So does injustice of other kinds.
I don’t pretend to have the full answer.
God knows.
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And Janice, I think voting early is clearly here to stay. I agree there should be safeguards when it comes to mailings of ballots — it should not be done carelessly or without checking voter rolls.
I now am so used to filling out my ballot and then dropping it at a nearby “Vote Center” (one is always near me and it feels more secure than a box at the park or a mail box). But no more trying to juggle what is typically a busy Election Day work schedule with trying to actually vote myself.
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Debra: “Surely Christians of all people, should have a default of peacefulness unless absolutely necessary. Sadly, this is not the case.”
I appreciate that point and suspect most of us do naturally *default* in that manner considering the horrific suffering war brings.
But it also has been said that there are worse evils than war. Those are the situation that become difficult to weigh, when others are suffering and being killed at the hands of wicked governments and it becomes too widespread and glaring to ignore.
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Of course the other issues come down to the world being so interconnected – we do not exist in a vacuum so ignoring issues beyond our borders often come our way to haunt and impact us as well.
These aren’t really black and white issues for either believers to view in strict biblical ways — or for nations to navigate amid many complexities and no shortage of unknown consequences. Hindsight, of course, is 20/20. But we don’t have that going into these issues.
We often get it wrong. Sometimes we get it right, even when we tried our best to ignore the inevitable (WWII).
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Some people enjoy being ground under by the opposition to everything we hold dear in the interest of “being nice”.
I ain’t one of them, obviously. But hey, keep kicking that dead horse.
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https://x.com/JDunlap1974/status/1795761070285414569?t=KL-Qng6C7F3-tVkxlDqyEQ&s=19
“BREAKING: New FOIA documents reveal that the Department of Justice and FBI uncovered alarming 2020 election ballot fraud in Detroit, Michigan but covered it up
In the emails, a DOJ official says “This allegation, and accompanying photos, is alarming. I would like FBI to look into this please.”
Someone at the Michigan Attorney General’s office also responded to the complaint, “Talked to the FBI on this and it’s not going to be in their lane or ours in terms of apparent criminal actions, but MDOS (Michigan Department of State) may want to call and try and head this off.”
Somehow the two investigative bureaus with real authority to investigate credible allegations decided to pass the buck to the Secretary of State, who would’ve been a huge reason why the election was so fraudulent in the first place. The corruption is so obvious.”
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So serious question.
Is it your “niceness” that prevents you from speaking out about the abuse and politicization of our justice system and govt? Because you never do. Just wondering why that is. Never any righteous indignation. Or is it just because Orange Man Bad, so you’ll excuse it?
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“Maybe I am sheltered, or am a member of a church that isn’t a “traditional evangelical” denomination or independent body, but I don’t find serious believers to be blood thirsty or loving war. So I suppose I’m asking if that criticism is really fair or not.”
Our very openly Evangelical Speaker of the House has declared himself a “war Speaker”. There is a huge overlap between neo-conservatives and evangelicals. The support from churches like yours happens in the comfort, safety and anonymity of the voting booth I think.
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You’d think logically that those who are totally anti-war, anti-guns, anti-death penalty, etc. would be anti-abortion considering blood of innocents is shed and weapons of mass destruction are used to deplete citizens of a certain race, but somehow there is a huge blind spot, a log jammed in the eye, or a brain disconnrct. It seems totally illogical. But here we are.
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Not sure what @5:50 refers to (our church being in the comfort, safety and anonymity of the voting booth?).
We’re a conservative Presbyterian church that understands the difference between church and state. As other churches (apparently, so I’ve read) pitch headlong into a politicized faith, ours thankfully has resisted.
The world throughout its history has often been in turmoil, nothing new under the sun. Our country — which is quite young, historically speaking — is in a difficult period that is testing our commitment to a democratic form of government in which people of differing backgrounds, races, creeds — and political persuasions — can co-exist. Perhaps it won’t work when all is said and done, but I hope this will be a temporary period.
AJ, I’m not sure whom you’re addressing, probably me as I’m the frequent target here, but how much power do you have in the country via your online activity, do you think? Not much — and that holds true for any of us.
I fail to see how online X’s rants and raves are helping much of anything.
Politics can become so overly important that folks can forget their first calling and first loyalty. It seems to be happening in the US more often than not lately.
I will pray for whomever becomes the next president.
Debra, never heard the term “war speaker.” I was rather dubious about Johnson (I think AJ called him my “boy” once, rather funny) and still don’t have an emotionally-strong “feeling” about him. Time will tell.
He’s got a hard job herding cats, I will say that.
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And I’m not trying to “be nice,” my aim is simply to be respectful on this thread – and try to understand where others are coming from while explaining my position.
I follow politics but not nearly as closely as some of you.
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Jesus is our example and He had a much more difficult row to hoe.
How are we doing?
mumsee
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Letter grade? 🙂
I am curious about how many churches represented here dabble at all in (current) politics from the pulpit or in any kind of an official way?
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Not really, from the pulpit but people do talk before and after so no official, and our pastor points us to God.
mumsee
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AJ & others @5:34: Serious answer.
I don’t find righteous indignation all that helpful to a discussion — and there already is plenty of that here to cover any lack of it from anyone else. The indignant tone and subject has already been exhaustively posted on most days.
Admittedly, too, I don’t usually trust the source material cited on this thread so unless I have time to research it (which I usually don’t) there’s nothing I can, in good conscience, say — without knowing more.
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mumsee, people will talk and that’s not surprising.
Anything from the pulpit is seriously another matter.
Both liberal and conservative churches have engaged in that, but it seems more prevalent in this political year from what I have been reading.
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Janice, I have often thought the same thing. To me there doesn’t seem to be a real pro-life agenda for either party. One has been ok killing people before they’re born, the other after —-both with very little pretext or justification. And more recently Democrats have been all on board with our endless wars.
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We went to a Baptist Church for a few years after we moved to the Chattanooga are. Politics was often front and center at the pulpit. I believe I mentioned we had Ted Cruz’s dad “minister” to us when Cruz was running for president. We had Mike Huckabee (who was at least a minister) for 4th of July one year. We had our DC representative show up for those. And the pastor was often overtly political.
We finally couldn’t take it anymore and went back to the denomination I grew up in. The pastor is a wonderful person who is devoted to Christ– well learned and wise beyond his years. However the whole denomination is seeped in the theology of Dispensationalism. As are many, many other evangelical denominations. And that is something we have been struggling to overcome. But at least pastor doesn’t preach politics from the pulpit. Usually.
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The death penalty is the “pro-life” exception argued about from the left. And some believers are divided on the death penalty as well.
Guess the question should center on are these issues completely interchangeable in their moral arguments or not (and for believers that has a basis in the Scriptures).
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Our church has a tradition (and conviction) of staying clear of politics on Sunday mornings (and, from what I’ve seen, any other time as well). Though as mumsee said, people outside will talk.
We’ve never passed out the “Voter Guides” at our church (so popular with some churches though) and have never (ever) had a political figure speak (this happens frequently in Black churches).
One of the people I sit next to usually, a young man, told me once in one of our ‘outdoor’ discussions that if he ever heard a politician’s name or some kind of ‘endorsement’ from the pulpit, he’d be gone.
Dispensationalism is a whole other issue (we’re not that either).
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“Moral equivalence” is the term I was trying to remember when comparing the death penalty, abortion, assisted suicide, war …
And AJ(?) @5:26, there are usually a whole lot dead horses hanging around this thread. lol
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(clarification: I was referring to repeated topics/themes — not people — in 8:23)
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Never at our church. I wouldn’t sit in one that talks politics from the pulpit. That’s not why I’m there.
You see even partisan people like me can separate church and politics.
Some others should try that. Leave your politics at the door for church, leave your pastor search out of politics. You won’t find one. Its a presidential search. So stop expecting to find one in our 2 party system.
AJ
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My post was referring to how we treat and communicate with other people, including with our fellow believers. And including on this blog.
But yes, even with people who one might consider “the opposition”, a respectful tone will get through much better than angry bile thrown at their face. That is not the same thing as merely being “nice”. And the Bible doesn’t make a distinction between how we should communicate with “good people” and how we should communicate with “bad people”. (In fact, we were all “bad people” before we found Christ.)
Do you consider DJ and me to be the opposition? Is that why you are rude and dismissive towards us or towards HRW? Refraining from rudeness is not merely being nice, it is effective communication, and it is biblical.
No, I do not excuse what is going on in the government or the justice system. Just because I do not comment on every issue does not mean that I don’t care. (In fact, I don’t comment much at all on many news issues. And as DJ said, “there already is plenty of that here to cover any lack of it from anyone else.”)
Despite my repeatedly saying that I am not a “Never-Trump” (or “Orange Man Bad”) kind of person, you continue to paint me as such. That makes it easy to be dismissive of me and my views.
I agree with what DJ addressed to you in 6:16, and her 6:25 comment.
But you’re right in that it is a dead horse. I almost did not bother sharing that. As one fellow believer to another, that is very sad.
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~ … As Christians, how can we learn to disagree well, especially with other Christians?
In 1970, Francis Schaeffer, one of the most astute apologists of the 20th century, published “The Mark of the Christian.” I first read the book about 50 years ago, and it continues to shape how I think about encounters like the one with my friend. It’s a brief book; you can read it in about an hour. Yet it may carry more weight today than at any time in the last half-century because it reminds us of the importance of loving our neighbor and being able to disagree well—vital skills in an increasingly polarized age.
The Mark of the Christian is Schaeffer’s meditation on two passages in John’s Gospel. He begins with John 13:34-35: “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another: just as I have loved you, you also are to love one another. By this all people will know that you are my disciples, if you have love for one another.”
Schaeffer marvels at Jesus’s words:
In the midst of the world, in the midst of our present dying culture, Jesus is giving a right to the world. Upon his authority he gives the world the right to judge whether you and I are born-again Christians on the basis of our observable love toward all Christians. . . .
https://www.thegospelcoalition.org/reviews/mark-christian/
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