Forget about immigration. The Pope/Trump dispute illuminates another issue. Trump and many Americans strongly resent it when a religious leader challenges their “faith”.
The Bible clearly shows that a primary job of religious leaders is to challenge the faith of others in order to cause the others to closely examine their faith or lack thereof.
I am going to stop mocking Trump. He is not a lunatic. He is just a man who likely has never heard the Gospel.
This pope almost speaks in bumper sticker phrases (and he may also not be translated all-too accurately at times). He’s not a careful speaker. He tends to “pop off” — or that’s how it seems. He is not “slow to speak.” So much of what he says on controversial topics winds up in a firestorm of controversy.
It was interesting (and odd) to me that “the wall,” of all things, is what prompted him to question Trump’s Christianity.
I see that Trump last night backed off of his “Bush lied” to get us into Iraq comment from last weekend’s debate.
Meanwhile, Sanders continues to be on a roll.
What a strange political year. Where will it all end up?
Interesting comment by a GOP friend — not a believer, more of a fiscal conservative (he leans socially conservative but can’t exactly explain why and those aren’t the issues that animate him — but he’s had it with liberals). He made the comment that Cruz “scares” him more than Trump, he thinks Cruz has some kind of a “personality disorder” or something, he just doesn’t like the guy. Again, there’s that almost visceral reaction that some people seem to have to Cruz.
donna j: That’s what I don’t understand – Sen. Cruz is a serious follower of Christ and a very principled leader and Constitutionalist, so why the visceral reactions, especially among believers?
The Pope/Trump dispute seems to be a matter of double hypocrisy. The Pope lives behind large walls with armed guards and didn’t Trump question the faith of both Carson and Cruz?
The hatred for Cruz is because too many people believe what they’re told about him by the press. Rather than investigate the man on their own, they take the word of liars.
And really, some people need to grow up. You don’t like or trust him because of the way he looks? Shallow much are ya’? 🙄
In my estimation, God has given us five hundred years to get this right. The land of plenty and of opportunity. And it has been a lot of good years. Yes, there have been troubles in the past and they have generally been dealt with, while people continued to try to honor Him, both as believers and not. The past seventy years, the people have been turning en masse from Him and His ways. There have always been unbelievers, but now, it appears, the preponderance of the people have turned. Perhaps God has accepted our decision to each do right in our own eyes.
kbells, there are plenty reasons to wonder if Trump is a Christian (mainly his statements about not having any need of repentance before God as he’s such a “good” person). His position on building a wall on the border doesn’t seem to be one of them. 🙂
Interesting, too — and I may have seen or interpreted this wrong, I only saw a quick clip after-the-fact, but it looked like there was a moment of silence at last Saturday’s debate for Scalia — and all the candidates had bowed heads except Trump, who stood through it with his head held high. I thought that seemed rather telling, somehow. But I don’t want to read too much into that having not really seen the clip in its entirety.
About Cruz: I don’t know, Tychicus, but I’m getting the feeling that it’s a reaction that’s not altogether uncommon, perhaps more among nonbelievers who are Republicans — and more among those who perhaps aren’t considered part of the “far-far” right?
But that’s the 2nd GOP acquaintance/friend of mine (the other one is a believer) who has expressed that opinion about him (well, Kim here would be #3 in just my immediate circle, perhaps).
I would certainly vote for him over any Democrat, though I’m not overly fond of his personality or approach and he’s more hard-line conservative on some issues than I am. But I am concerned that some of the reaction I notice among Republican friends could make him not as strong as a general election candidate.
I don’t mean to re-visit something that’s been brought up here before, I’m not trying to be argumentative — I know many really like him. And on most of the issues, I agree with him and would vote for him if he’s the nominee. He’s just not my first choice and others seem to feel more strongly (in a negative way) about him.
But in the end, there is no “perfect” candidate — something I learned many years ago. You go with what you’ve got.
My opinion of Cruz went from, okay, he makes a good third choice to, hmm, I am not impressed when he seemed to not have much control over his campaign. Seems like a nice enough guy, but it appears he has allowed the dishonesty of politics to creep into his life. Even if he is not participating, he is surrounding himself with those who do.
I would say, I prefer honesty and commitment, passion, resourcefulness, and love of country and its people over political experience. Carson.
I would say, I prefer honesty, willingness to change when proven wrong, love of country, and passion over age. Rubio.
And I would say honesty and passion, love of country, and ignorance of those wrong tactics used by his people. Cruz.
To be President, a person ought to be honest so the people here and abroad can believe what he says. If he tells Putin, don’t, then Putin ought to know the President is going to follow through. Kind of like parenting. He needs to be committed to what he believes and have a passion for getting there. Loving this country and the people in it are requirements.
Willingness to change when he sees he has made an error but not for political gain. Ability to tap into knowledgeable resources. Passion for what he thinks this country needs. These are all important.
I don’t think it’s his looks, it’s probably more about his personality, how he comes across — but also, of more substance, his more ‘far’ right positions that simply don’t appeal to everyone within the Republican fold. I suspect that’s what bothers the friend who spoke up yesterday who is conservative … but not *that* conservative on all social issues.
We obviously don’t personally know any of these people — and politicians, in general, are what they are. 😦
So we make our decisions the best we can and based on what matches our own nuanced views sometimes. It’s not a one-size-fits-all, even among conservatives.
Hopefully this will all produce a nominee that most can and will support in a general election against a (much) more liberal foe.
Although I’m wondering if Biden isn’t waiting in the wings, being quickly groomed by the panicky party brass … Of course, he’s still a liberal, too, just not as frightening perhaps has a Hillary or a Bernie. 😮
Back to Trump and whether he’s a Christian — no one knows another’s heart, of course, so in the ultimate sense we can’t truly say whether he is or is not a believer. The evidence (to me) points toward a conclusion that he, at the least, does not have a grasp or real understanding of the gospel, however.
Interesting piece on the influencers behind the scenes for this election, from Drudge to Obama:
… While the Vermont senator and real estate mogul have defied all pundit predictions, there are power brokers on both sides of aisle who will play major roles in deciding who will advance to the general election. Some are fans of the grassroots movements that have catapulted Trump and Sanders; some are not.
The following is a list of major power players who could alter the 2016 election. …
__________________________________________
I agree with Mumsee that Carson appears to be the better man, but I predict he will be the next to drop out. Jeb! has the money to keep going and Kasich has actual delegates. Carson would make a good Secretary of Health and Human Services. And Trey Gouwdy as Attorney General. .
Jeb! is sounding like SC could be his last stand. I think everyone realizes that a smaller field going forward is going to be better for the party as a whole in the face of The Donald phenomenon. 🙂
I’m sorry Carson didn’t do better — in part, though, I wasn’t sure his whole heart was in it. He would be an excellent secretary of health & human services.
Someone suggested Christie as atty general. But I (and many others, I suspect) am pretty much over him. 🙂
“Behold, the days are coming,” declares the Lord God, “when I will send a famine on the land— not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the Lord (Amos 8:11).
The business of religion for some can be a very profitable profession to enter. Most people think of that sentence in the spiritual sense, but this article is about the physical worldly dollar.
It might be argued that the reason why ministers are more likely to make money today is because they utilize more money making opportunities such as writing books, producing movies and speaking engagements.
Some of which make enough to have private planes (Eddie Long) refurbished arenas as churches (Joel Osteen) and flourishing press houses (Rick Warren).
There will be many who will say that these pastors shouldn’t be making this much money. Before you judge, keep in mind that the average yearly household salary in The Democratic Republic of Congo in Africa is $422, so they could be saying the same about you!
This article is not to bash anyone, it is written to inspire you to dream bigger. If you are not interested in making money, then that is your choice but here are men and women who inspire others while achieving their dreams. …
Trump a Christian? I have serious doubts. “You shall know them by their fruits,” said Jesus. What are Trump’s fruits? Swearing at rallies, divorcing two times.
Another thing I cringe over is we have a seat open in the state of Alabama. The incumbent is running ads on his fighting Obama on this that and the other. Obama isn’t who you are running against anymore. I no longer care how you fought Obama in the past. I am interested in what you are going to do going forward. http://www.byrneforcongress.com/2016/02/on-heels-of-major-endorsements-bradley-byrne-releases-first-tv-ad-of-2016/
One hundred percent pro-life.
One hundred percent pro-gun.
Alabama’s most conservative Member of Congress.
Bradley Byrne.
He stood up to President Obama to keep America safe from terrorism.
To end Obama’s Amnesty, to keep ISIS refugees from moving here.
To rebuild our military and support the troops.
The National Review said Byrne proves a conservative can rack up legislative wins, and quickly.
Bradley Byrne: the real Alabama conservative.
BYRNE: I’m Bradley Byrne and I approve this Message.
A portion of a letter to the editor in today’s Times-News
Just imagine what it will be like 20 years from down the road after decades of tuition-free college education being available for our youths, Imagine these next generations no longer burdened with $50,000 – plus of student loan debt.
Imagine having universal health care that many other countries have had for years……….
Bernie knows it’s time for a political revolution……….
Imagine having a million dollars in your pocket, but your dinner cost $785,000. That’s where we’re going with such schemes.
It’s easy to imagine such solutions until you realize that the rest of the world is affected by every action you take.
Ain’t nothing free.
Except salvation. The most valuable thing of all, going for free to you.
Everything else costs YOU something.
My biggest fear and gripe with socialism is that you’re trading individual rights & independence by giving government so much control over your lives.
It’s really antithetical to how our nation was set up and would represent a major break (even though we’ve been heading in that direction for some time).
We should be able to say we’d rather be poor and free than “taken care of” financially with restrictions, whether it’s on your income or how you can practice your religion or your speech in the public square or your business & earning opportunities or medical care …
Wandering Views 
Forget about immigration. The Pope/Trump dispute illuminates another issue. Trump and many Americans strongly resent it when a religious leader challenges their “faith”.
The Bible clearly shows that a primary job of religious leaders is to challenge the faith of others in order to cause the others to closely examine their faith or lack thereof.
I am going to stop mocking Trump. He is not a lunatic. He is just a man who likely has never heard the Gospel.
LikeLiked by 1 person
My General Lee avatar is apparently on vacation.
LikeLiked by 1 person
I’m guessing your General Lee avatar is not vacationing here in New England among the Yankees. 😉
LikeLiked by 2 people
Could you give an example of where “the Bible clearly shows that a primary job of religious leaders is to challenge the faith of others.”
LikeLike
This pope almost speaks in bumper sticker phrases (and he may also not be translated all-too accurately at times). He’s not a careful speaker. He tends to “pop off” — or that’s how it seems. He is not “slow to speak.” So much of what he says on controversial topics winds up in a firestorm of controversy.
It was interesting (and odd) to me that “the wall,” of all things, is what prompted him to question Trump’s Christianity.
I see that Trump last night backed off of his “Bush lied” to get us into Iraq comment from last weekend’s debate.
Meanwhile, Sanders continues to be on a roll.
What a strange political year. Where will it all end up?
Interesting comment by a GOP friend — not a believer, more of a fiscal conservative (he leans socially conservative but can’t exactly explain why and those aren’t the issues that animate him — but he’s had it with liberals). He made the comment that Cruz “scares” him more than Trump, he thinks Cruz has some kind of a “personality disorder” or something, he just doesn’t like the guy. Again, there’s that almost visceral reaction that some people seem to have to Cruz.
LikeLike
donna j: That’s what I don’t understand – Sen. Cruz is a serious follower of Christ and a very principled leader and Constitutionalist, so why the visceral reactions, especially among believers?
LikeLike
The Pope/Trump dispute seems to be a matter of double hypocrisy. The Pope lives behind large walls with armed guards and didn’t Trump question the faith of both Carson and Cruz?
LikeLike
I think a more troubling thing about Trump from a Christian perspective is that he appears to be a two time,(at least), unrepentant adulterer.
LikeLike
The hatred for Cruz is because too many people believe what they’re told about him by the press. Rather than investigate the man on their own, they take the word of liars.
And really, some people need to grow up. You don’t like or trust him because of the way he looks? Shallow much are ya’? 🙄
LikeLike
In my estimation, God has given us five hundred years to get this right. The land of plenty and of opportunity. And it has been a lot of good years. Yes, there have been troubles in the past and they have generally been dealt with, while people continued to try to honor Him, both as believers and not. The past seventy years, the people have been turning en masse from Him and His ways. There have always been unbelievers, but now, it appears, the preponderance of the people have turned. Perhaps God has accepted our decision to each do right in our own eyes.
LikeLiked by 2 people
kbells, there are plenty reasons to wonder if Trump is a Christian (mainly his statements about not having any need of repentance before God as he’s such a “good” person). His position on building a wall on the border doesn’t seem to be one of them. 🙂
Interesting, too — and I may have seen or interpreted this wrong, I only saw a quick clip after-the-fact, but it looked like there was a moment of silence at last Saturday’s debate for Scalia — and all the candidates had bowed heads except Trump, who stood through it with his head held high. I thought that seemed rather telling, somehow. But I don’t want to read too much into that having not really seen the clip in its entirety.
About Cruz: I don’t know, Tychicus, but I’m getting the feeling that it’s a reaction that’s not altogether uncommon, perhaps more among nonbelievers who are Republicans — and more among those who perhaps aren’t considered part of the “far-far” right?
But that’s the 2nd GOP acquaintance/friend of mine (the other one is a believer) who has expressed that opinion about him (well, Kim here would be #3 in just my immediate circle, perhaps).
I would certainly vote for him over any Democrat, though I’m not overly fond of his personality or approach and he’s more hard-line conservative on some issues than I am. But I am concerned that some of the reaction I notice among Republican friends could make him not as strong as a general election candidate.
I don’t mean to re-visit something that’s been brought up here before, I’m not trying to be argumentative — I know many really like him. And on most of the issues, I agree with him and would vote for him if he’s the nominee. He’s just not my first choice and others seem to feel more strongly (in a negative way) about him.
But in the end, there is no “perfect” candidate — something I learned many years ago. You go with what you’ve got.
LikeLike
My opinion of Cruz went from, okay, he makes a good third choice to, hmm, I am not impressed when he seemed to not have much control over his campaign. Seems like a nice enough guy, but it appears he has allowed the dishonesty of politics to creep into his life. Even if he is not participating, he is surrounding himself with those who do.
LikeLike
I would say, I prefer honesty and commitment, passion, resourcefulness, and love of country and its people over political experience. Carson.
I would say, I prefer honesty, willingness to change when proven wrong, love of country, and passion over age. Rubio.
And I would say honesty and passion, love of country, and ignorance of those wrong tactics used by his people. Cruz.
To be President, a person ought to be honest so the people here and abroad can believe what he says. If he tells Putin, don’t, then Putin ought to know the President is going to follow through. Kind of like parenting. He needs to be committed to what he believes and have a passion for getting there. Loving this country and the people in it are requirements.
Willingness to change when he sees he has made an error but not for political gain. Ability to tap into knowledgeable resources. Passion for what he thinks this country needs. These are all important.
LikeLiked by 1 person
I don’t think it’s his looks, it’s probably more about his personality, how he comes across — but also, of more substance, his more ‘far’ right positions that simply don’t appeal to everyone within the Republican fold. I suspect that’s what bothers the friend who spoke up yesterday who is conservative … but not *that* conservative on all social issues.
LikeLike
And, yes, some of the campaign tactics aren’t appealing (photo-shopping pictures, etc.). Cruz seems to play rough.
LikeLike
We obviously don’t personally know any of these people — and politicians, in general, are what they are. 😦
So we make our decisions the best we can and based on what matches our own nuanced views sometimes. It’s not a one-size-fits-all, even among conservatives.
Hopefully this will all produce a nominee that most can and will support in a general election against a (much) more liberal foe.
Although I’m wondering if Biden isn’t waiting in the wings, being quickly groomed by the panicky party brass … Of course, he’s still a liberal, too, just not as frightening perhaps has a Hillary or a Bernie. 😮
LikeLike
Back to Trump and whether he’s a Christian — no one knows another’s heart, of course, so in the ultimate sense we can’t truly say whether he is or is not a believer. The evidence (to me) points toward a conclusion that he, at the least, does not have a grasp or real understanding of the gospel, however.
Interesting piece on the influencers behind the scenes for this election, from Drudge to Obama:
http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/269946-the-power-brokers-who-could-decide-the-2016-election
________________________________________
… While the Vermont senator and real estate mogul have defied all pundit predictions, there are power brokers on both sides of aisle who will play major roles in deciding who will advance to the general election. Some are fans of the grassroots movements that have catapulted Trump and Sanders; some are not.
The following is a list of major power players who could alter the 2016 election. …
__________________________________________
LikeLike
I agree with Mumsee that Carson appears to be the better man, but I predict he will be the next to drop out. Jeb! has the money to keep going and Kasich has actual delegates. Carson would make a good Secretary of Health and Human Services. And Trey Gouwdy as Attorney General. .
LikeLiked by 1 person
Jeb! is sounding like SC could be his last stand. I think everyone realizes that a smaller field going forward is going to be better for the party as a whole in the face of The Donald phenomenon. 🙂
I’m sorry Carson didn’t do better — in part, though, I wasn’t sure his whole heart was in it. He would be an excellent secretary of health & human services.
Someone suggested Christie as atty general. But I (and many others, I suspect) am pretty much over him. 🙂
LikeLiked by 1 person
Posted by our pastor on FB:
“Behold, the days are coming,” declares the Lord God, “when I will send a famine on the land— not a famine of bread, nor a thirst for water, but of hearing the words of the Lord (Amos 8:11).
With this link:
http://www.etinside.com/?p=11679
________________________________
The business of religion for some can be a very profitable profession to enter. Most people think of that sentence in the spiritual sense, but this article is about the physical worldly dollar.
It might be argued that the reason why ministers are more likely to make money today is because they utilize more money making opportunities such as writing books, producing movies and speaking engagements.
Some of which make enough to have private planes (Eddie Long) refurbished arenas as churches (Joel Osteen) and flourishing press houses (Rick Warren).
There will be many who will say that these pastors shouldn’t be making this much money. Before you judge, keep in mind that the average yearly household salary in The Democratic Republic of Congo in Africa is $422, so they could be saying the same about you!
This article is not to bash anyone, it is written to inspire you to dream bigger. If you are not interested in making money, then that is your choice but here are men and women who inspire others while achieving their dreams. …
__________________________________
LikeLike
Trump a Christian? I have serious doubts. “You shall know them by their fruits,” said Jesus. What are Trump’s fruits? Swearing at rallies, divorcing two times.
And on forgiveness: “I am not sure I have,” Trump said when asked if he’d ever asked God for forgiveness. “I just go on and try to do a better job from there. I don’t think so,” he said. “I think if I do something wrong, I think, I just try and make it right. I don’t bring God into that picture. I don’t.”.
What? He doesn’t “bring God into the picture” when he sins? That is not the fruit of a Christian.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Another thing I cringe over is we have a seat open in the state of Alabama. The incumbent is running ads on his fighting Obama on this that and the other. Obama isn’t who you are running against anymore. I no longer care how you fought Obama in the past. I am interested in what you are going to do going forward.
http://www.byrneforcongress.com/2016/02/on-heels-of-major-endorsements-bradley-byrne-releases-first-tv-ad-of-2016/
One hundred percent pro-life.
One hundred percent pro-gun.
Alabama’s most conservative Member of Congress.
Bradley Byrne.
He stood up to President Obama to keep America safe from terrorism.
To end Obama’s Amnesty, to keep ISIS refugees from moving here.
To rebuild our military and support the troops.
The National Review said Byrne proves a conservative can rack up legislative wins, and quickly.
Bradley Byrne: the real Alabama conservative.
BYRNE: I’m Bradley Byrne and I approve this Message.
LikeLike
Those are the remarks that show he clearly hasn’t ‘heard’ (whether it’s been preached in his presence or not) to the point of embracing the gospel. …
God can still regenerate him — and may even be in that process now, we can’t really see that.
But Peter is right, the outward evidence at this point isn’t really there. Yet. 🙂
Hope springs eternal (for such were some of you …)
LikeLike
A portion of a letter to the editor in today’s Times-News
Just imagine what it will be like 20 years from down the road after decades of tuition-free college education being available for our youths, Imagine these next generations no longer burdened with $50,000 – plus of student loan debt.
Imagine having universal health care that many other countries have had for years……….
Bernie knows it’s time for a political revolution……….
Imagine having a million dollars in your pocket, but your dinner cost $785,000. That’s where we’re going with such schemes.
It’s easy to imagine such solutions until you realize that the rest of the world is affected by every action you take.
Ain’t nothing free.
Except salvation. The most valuable thing of all, going for free to you.
Everything else costs YOU something.
LikeLiked by 2 people
And often it’s your freedom.
My biggest fear and gripe with socialism is that you’re trading individual rights & independence by giving government so much control over your lives.
It’s really antithetical to how our nation was set up and would represent a major break (even though we’ve been heading in that direction for some time).
LikeLike
We should be able to say we’d rather be poor and free than “taken care of” financially with restrictions, whether it’s on your income or how you can practice your religion or your speech in the public square or your business & earning opportunities or medical care …
LikeLike
Linda, I said “a primary job” not “the primary job”.
Look at the preaching of John the Baptist in Matthew 3:7-10. See how that preaching was endorsed by Jesus in Matthew 21:32.
Hopefully, General Lee is back.
LikeLike
Sorry, Linda. You correctly quoted me.
LikeLike
As for candidates’ salvation, I wouldn’t presume to guess which ones have it.
http://www.christiantoday.com/article/what.do.we.know.about.the.faith.of.the.2016.presidential.candidates.so.far/51847.htm
Very interesting.
LikeLike