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Our Daily Thread 6-9-14

Good Morning!

On this day in 1534 Jacques Cartier became the first to sail into the river he named Saint Lawrence.

In 1790 John Barry copyrighted “Philadelphia Spelling Book.” It was the first American book to be copyrighted. 

In 1934 Donald Duck made his debut in the Silly Symphonies cartoon “The Wise Little Hen.” 

In 1943 the withholding tax on payrolls was authorized by Congress. 

In 1957 Chas married his wife Elvera. 🙂

And in 1959 the first ballistic missile carrying submarine, the USS George Washington, was launched. 

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Quote of the Day

“What’s the good of a home, if you are never in it?”

Weedon Grossmith

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 For Chas and Elvera, the Anniversary Song. From Gismo Graf Trio

Today is Les Paul’s birthday.

And it’s Cole Porter’s too.

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Anyone have a QoD?

58 thoughts on “Our Daily Thread 6-9-14”

  2. Wow, Chas, you and Elvera made the daily thread. That makes your day on the official list!
    So nice to have a holiday today. Report cards are done, though I still have time to do some tweaking.
    Wisdom appreciated about what to do about my van which is parked down the hill at the market. Perhaps time for a new battery?

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  3. Good morning!
    Good evening, Jo!

    It was interesting to read on the political thread about how fasting for three days benefits or kickstarts the immune system.

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  7. Jo, is preparing report cards a difficult tug at your heart or a delight because you are able to give mostly As? I think for the young children it would be especially hard to assign grades. We had to do some skills tests for preschoolers and even that seemed difficult because sometimes they don’t want to do what they are asked to do for the test when they really can do it.

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  9. I had a friend who had grandsons that she liked to take fishing over at the Stone Mountain lake. That was closer to fifteen years ago, but I did not have a license to fish then. Children could fish without a license. The boys did not catch any fish, but we tried. My brother and I took my son to a trout stocked pond when he was quite young. Everyone caught trout there and you paid by the pound. It could get quite expensive. The wind blew my brother’s hat off his head into the water and we had to retrieve it from the other side of the pond 🙂

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  10. You do know that Ginger Rogers had to do everything Fred Astaire did…only backwards in high heels!

    Yesterday was Pentecost Sunday. I know some of you attend churches where there is Speaking in Tongues. Based on last week’s question of God actually speaking to us through other people, what do you think of Speaking in Tongues/The Baptism of the Holy Spirit?(disclsimer: my father grew up in the Assembly of God church)
    Do you think it is of God? Do you think it is a hoax? This isn’t an argumentative question.

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  11. I’ve attended a couple liturgical churches where speaking in tongues was permitted within the guidelines set out in 1 Corinthians. I don’t have a problem with it unless it’s used to call attention to the speaker and not God.

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  12. Thankye, thankye, everyone. The people at the Y wished Elvera a happy anniversary too.
    Our first meal, (after we left the reception) was at a truck stop.
    Our twenty-fifth anniversary meal was at Wendy’s. (I think I told you about that.)
    We’ll do something, don’t know what yet, maybe Outback. Elvera’s sister always goes to a fancy place. We don’t.
    That is some fancy guitar work, especially with a straight pick.
    After that, there’s an option for Andy Williams; “Anniversary Song”, but I couldn’t open it.

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  13. I don’t know much about it, Kim. I have not given it much thought.

    My current Baptist church does not seem to make mention of Pentecost unless it is in the Scripture for a particular Sunday. In the Methodist church ladies would tend to wear red on Pentecost and it was recognized in various ways in the service. It seemed the Methodist church was a little more involved concerning the Holy Spirit than either the Presbyterian or Baptist. It may not be the same in all those churches, but at least in ones I have attended.

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  14. A difficult question to answer succinctly Kim. My parents belonged to the Church of God, Cleveland, Tenn. (There are others.) They believe that the gift of the Holy Spirit is first apparent by the speaking in tongues. i.e. A person doesn’t have the “baptism of the Spirit” until the speaking in tongues occurs. That does not mean that they believe Baptists, Methodists, etc. are lost. Only that they do not have the baptism of the Holy Spirit.
    They believed, probably still do, that there are three progressive spiritual steps.
    a. Salvation, b. Sanctification, c. The gift of the Holy Spirit, evidenced by speaking in tongues.
    I have a friend from my seminary days who speaks in tongues (while praying, etc.).

    What do I think? I have mixed feelings. It is not a hoax, Paul describes it as a gift, so is interpretation of tongues. it is one of the gifts of the Spirit. It seems, to me to have no purpose. My seminary friend says it is a real blessing, but doesn’t push it. (I learned more in a few minutes talking with him than I ever did with my parents because they were more defensive than informative.)
    There’s more to say, but this is enough.

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  15. I’ll post this over a few days so that everyone gets a chance to see it. On July 5, Kim, Ajisuun, and AJ and family are gathering at our house for a mini blog get-together. All who can get to Stewartstown, Pennsylvania that day are welcome, including friends and family. Just let me know so I can plan the food. We would love it if some others could join us.

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  16. ¡Feliz Anniversario de la Boda, Chas!

    As I said the other day, I’ve never been fishing. But I wouldn’t mind spending the day at the creek/river in the picture. BTW- What makes a creek a river? In Arizona, we had no flowing rivers, but there were a wide dry washes in Tucson. Two were called rivers, the other a wash. None had water in them except after heavy rains. So, when I moved to Missouri and saw all these narrow waterways that they called rivers or creeks, I had to wonder what the difference is? Does it have to do with lenght or how much land area slopes into it?

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  18. I have other things to do today and got dressed and ready to go, but I still don’t feel well. I may have a stomach bug. Probably got it at VBS.

    I appreciate your explanation, Chas. I did once visit a church with a work friend who was not living as a Christian so I would have discounted whatever I saw along those lines based on her hypocrisy. That was before I was saved. Can’t even remember if they had anyone speaking in tongues during the service. I was curious. I think it was an evening service and did not have anyone doing it or I would remember. I wanted to see what it was like out of curiosity. Now I do believe it can be real, but based on what you said about baptism in the Holy Spirit, I don’t think I can go along with that exclusive take on the Holy Spirit.

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  19. Without looking it up, I think of a river as a main artery and creeks as veins. It may also have to do with their capacity of water they hold within their banks. River “banks” hold treasure more valuable than gold for a thirsy person.

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  20. Re: speaking in tongues

    The first non-Catholic church I attended was a non-denominational, Charismatic church. Speaking in tongues was common, but I don’t think the main pastor believed one needed to speak in tongues to be saved, as do other Pentecostal groups. Now I attend a church that doesn’t have the practice, but believes that as a gift of the Holy Spirit, it is something that God still uses today, yet not as prevalent in areas where Christianity is established. I saw some who seemed to be really filled with the Spirit speaking in tongues, but I saw a lot of people just speaking like “a clanging symbol”. I was a young believer and often couldn’t tell the difference, even when I, myself, spoke in tongues.

    It seems to me now, in my studies and hearing teaching on the subject, that God used tongues and the sign gifts (prophesying, healing, etc) in the early church as a way to break through to the lost masses and as a sign to the believers of the Holy Spirit coming to the Gentiles. We believe that in these days, people in the non-Western cultures (Europe and the Americas), who have never had any contact with Christianity, are brought to the truth through such gifts. If you read the book of Acts, some were filled with the Spirit without any mention of tongues. Cornelius and his household received the Spirit with tongues as a sign to Peter and the other believers, that the Gentiles had received the Spirit “as we did”. However, in places like Athens, there is no mention of tongues being the sign that the Greeks were saved.

    So, while I believe there are times in our day when tongues are of the Lord, I also believe that most (not all) of what we see in the US is sensationalism, and not the baptism of the Holy Spirit .

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  21. Janice @9:53- It may also have to do with their capacity of water they hold within their banks.

    I can understand that explanation. But whoever named some of the waterways around here must not have known that. There is one just north of our town that has “river” in its name, but is less than 50 feet wide at its confluence with the Mississippi.

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  22. Re river vs creek: when we saw the Sugar Creek last year (of “Sugar Creek Gang” books fame), my husband asserted it’s not a creek but a river. I think (but am not sure) that a river flows into the ocean, but I don’t know what a creek does. To me, a creek is a stream that makes noise . . . but then, what is a brook?

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  23. Re speaking in tongues: I think that God can still give someone the gift today; I’ve heard a missionary story or two along that line. But I think as a general rule, the sign gifts were part of the founding of the church and aren’t part of worship today. The fact that they died out for centuries and then were “revived” by people who wanted them to happen would seem to point to that explanation.

    There are a lot of parts of modern Pentecostal/Charismatic Christianity that are fraudulent or heretical, from Benny Hinn on down. My personal argument to those who would say that speaking in tongues is necessary for one to be filled with the Holy Spirit (other than that Scripture doesn’t say that!) is simply this: If that is true, we would expect the greatest spiritual maturity in churches that taught and practiced it; instead, we have a great mix of heresy and spiritual immaturity, along with a few spiritually mature Christians. Very often tongues speaking and other dramatic signs are emphasized at the expense of other doctrines, and that does not lead to spiritual maturity. If this were truth, it would have some better influence on people’s lives. (And yes, to some degree the same statement could be made of the church as a whole; but I think overall we have a sad weakness of doctrinal discernment in today’s churches.)

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  24. Cheryl @10:29- If a river flows in to the ocean and a creek doesn’t, than what about the Missouri and Ohio Rivers (and others) that flow into the Mississippi? (Though there are some who think the Mississippi flows into the Missouri, and that it is the Missouri that flows into the Gulf of Mexico, based on satellite photographs.)

    Cheryl @10:37- Good answer. I saw a lot of immaturity (myself included) in the Charismatic church I attended. And sometimes it was encouraged form the leadership!

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  26. Good points Peter and Cheryl. Both churches I attended would not accept a “tongue speaking prophecy” if it did not meet the criteria in Corinthians. Mostly it was used for praising God.

    We sang a terrific song about Pentecost yesterday, including the cello, flute and piano. Can’t find the recording just yet and it’s time to dance. Bye!

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  27. Tongues being speaking in another (known) language, of course. 😉 I had a friend who was a new Christian and made to feel pretty inadequate by her charismatic pastor at the time because she wasn’t getting it. He offered to coach her. At that point she said even she (in her new faith) knew something was a amiss.

    Ah, it’s Monday again. So soon.

    Happy anniversary Chas and Elvera, go treat yourselves to a fancy lunch or dinner.

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  31. She decided. It’s Cracker Barrel for us.
    Goose Creek in South Carolina is larger than the Broad River in NC.
    It’s really the Ohio that flows into the Gulf. I understand that the Ohio provides most of the water.
    Yapamom, We’ve met you before, but I forgot. Were you someone else on WMBlog?
    I know of no group of people who believe that speaking in tongues is necessary for salvation.

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  34. As birthday month continues, the two daughter-in-laws went out together and got their hair done and colored Saturday. Just got a sweet note from one thanking me for the gift. We’re very blessed with these two fine young women and their spectacular children!

    Pity the soon-to-be three, however, who can’t understand why all these family members are having birthday parties when surely it’s her turn now? (One more to go before her!)

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  35. Hi yapamom. 🙂

    But, Chas, speaking in tongues (not another language but your own ‘private’ language that no one else can understand) has been set up in some churches as attaining something of a ‘super’ Christian status.

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  37. Yapa is from Quechua (Indian language spoken in Ecuador). It means a bonus, like something thrown into the deal at a market to sweeten the deal. We called our baby daughter that as a nickname. Now baby daughter is just barely a teenager.

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  38. Question for Mumsee, but any others are welcome to chime in. I was thinking/praying for an adopted kids I know and wondered if the anger and fury their saintly parents put up with in the kids’ teens is really a reaction to the abandonment they feel from the original parents?

    Some of their behavior would be developmental, of course (got to love those teenage girls!), but I wonder if some of it is misplaced anger. The adoptive parents are the ones who’ve loved them all these years, but the kids don’t realize their hurt is from the birth parents, not the current ones.

    Just a thought and a little more insight to pray if true. Thanks.

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  39. Speaking in tongues was a sign you had been filled with the Holy Spirit in the 1970s. I don’t subscribe to that belief–you see the fruit of the Spirit in people’s lives, that’s the sign.

    I think it was mishandled, which again, is why it’s so important to stress the need for order as found in Scripture.

    As usual, people botch God’s work when they try to “help” him. 😦

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  41. Thank you for all the welcomes. I guess you could say Linda flushed me out of hiding when she mentioned a get together at her house in Stewardstown, PA. That is quite close to where I live.

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  43. Michelle,

    “I was thinking/praying for an adopted kids I know and wondered if the anger and fury their saintly parents put up with in the kids’ teens is really a reaction to the abandonment they feel from the original parents?”

    Speaking as the spouse of an adopted child, and from our conversations on the subject, Yes, partly. But there’s way more to it than just that.

    It’s not only the feelings of abandonment, but the feelings of not belonging where they are, or (in their mind) not belonging anywhere else. Also there can be issues with not feeling like you’re one of the family and not as good as the natural children of the family. It’s complicated.

    I’m no expert, but my wife can share more with you if she choses to. She can explain it way better than I can. Mumsee probably can too. 🙂

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  44. Michelle, yes, we think so. At least a lot of it. Some is a result of drugs and such bio moms used while the child was in utero and child needs to learn to control it but it takes a lot of work. Babies bond to their bio moms in the womb and especially during the first three years. If they are removed during that time, it is very difficult for them to bond and get rid of the abandonment anger. Older ones, if they did not bond to mom and dad due to issues at home, have a hard time as well. If they did bond, it is difficult because they were then abandoned and you, the parents, stole the child from his “real” parents. We talk about that a lot here and have very few anger issues at all. We discuss the birth moms and dads to the best of our ability, in a very positive light. “Your folks loved you, but drugs took hold and they were unable to make the right choice due to the brain damage caused by the drugs” All of ours suffered from the added bonus of being abandoned by adoptive parents before us, kicked out of the second home. Or third. That is hard on folks, to think that they are not good enough for anybody to want. And to prove it, they can behave quite badly. Destruction, anger, sexual acting out, etc. Just gotta prove that you won’t love me if I am bad enough.

    But God can and does intervene. Ours, as mentioned, seem to be on a pretty good course now. We have worked hard to build their self confidence and to help them see who they are in Christ. We are all worthless but He loves us anyway and suddenly we have great worth.

    If you know any adoptive or foster parents, please pray for them.

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  46. Yes, we also work hard, as do our bio children, at letting them see they are just as valuable. That, yes, the bio children did this and that, but you dear child, did this big thing as well. They have almost free reign here for a lot of things, and lots of around the place jobs to keep them connected, letting them have ownership. We think that is helping them to know they belong here.

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  49. Mumsee (and others), several years ago I read (don’t remember where) that one problem for today’s children is that human beings were made with a desire to be needed, to know we “matter.” In the old days, kids worked and saw their place in the family. If you were responsible for feeding the chickens, gathering the eggs, sweeping the house on Tuesday, and taking care of an acre of beans, you could see how you contributed to the family. If everyone is catering to your needs but at the same time you’re peripheral to their lives (you’re in day care all day, with a new “teacher” every six months on average, and you rarely see your parents and hardly ever see them when they’re not exhausted), your role in the family is no more important than the family cat, and maybe less. And American culture makes a really big deal about what a sacrifice children are: getting pregnant is something you do “accidentally,” children are a nuisance, they interfere with your career and your freedom (as little as possible, with day care and so forth, but inevitably they do so at least somewhat), and it’s best to wait several years to have children and to have no more than two, with none or one maybe being a better option. Whether or not you bear a child once you’re pregnant is totally optional, too.

    I think that’s part of the reason Mumsee’s model works. The children can see their place in the family. They make a positive contribution . . . but a positive contribution within a relationship, not an employee-level one. They also are growing up with genuine skills and knowledge, not empty “build your self-esteem” praise with no foundation.

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  51. Cheryl, that is why it is so effective around here to fire people from chores. When they first arrive, they have no interest in doing the chores properly, just doing them for fun. Then they get fired and see all of the others working and enjoying it. They quickly learn how to hold their jobs.

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  52. Way, way back in the comments to Janice asking me a question about report cards.
    In the younger grades, the children receive a 1, 2, 3, or 4 on report cards. That part was not too hard. I had done assessments and it was pretty clearcut. Then I write comments, that is much harder, but I try to tell them actual facts about what I see in class or on the assessments. All the while staying positive. For instance, I mentioned how many questions one child asks, but don’t mention how, some days, it drives me crazy. 🙂

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  53. Jo, that seems like a good way to do it. When my son was in two-year-old preschool for a short time ( I pulled him out because of asthma that year) he came home one day with a frown face stamped on his hand. That really made me mad because the first grade I ever got in school was a frown face on a math test in first grade. We were given the test before being taught to see how much we knew. No one had ever taught me math. I was sadder than the frown face on my paper. So when I saw that frown face on my son’s hand I was one frown faced mom! 😦

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  56. Happy Anniversary, Chas & Elvera!

    The parents of a friend recently celebrated their 60th (I think) anniversary. Lots of photos were taken of the couple with their children & grandchildren, & I guess some great-grands, too. The theme of the gathering was “All Because Two People Fell In Love”. 🙂

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  57. Karen, actually the gathering wasn’t because two people fell in love, but because two people chose to keep the lifetime commitment they made after they fell in love. Anyone can do the first; not everyone is willing to do the second.

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  58. I knew someone would quibble with that. 🙂

    Yes, Cheryl, that is certainly true. But it was too long to put on the banner. 😉

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