Good morning! This is the Daily thread, you decide what we talk about. Enjoy your day.
Quote of the Day
“I tremble for my country when I reflect that God is just; that his justice cannot sleep forever.”
Thomas Jefferson
Wandering Views
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Wandering Views 
Busy day around these parts. Work, Women’s Council of REALTORS, a slumber party–last night Baby Girl tried to add another friend to the mix. I told her if the girl showed up I would pack everyone up and return them to their parents. I told her 3 girls NOT 4 and if the 4th arrived it was over. Give her an inch and she wants the whole freeway.
I haven’t said a lot about this situation for privacy reasons, but I am terrified that a friend’s ex-husband is going to kill her. She has a protective order but he has money and is slick. It is effecting their child.
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Good quote! Jefferson was strange. He was not orthodox. However, he was brilliant and he understood slavery very well.
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Morning all
Love the quote — Thomas Jefferson, among the founders my favorite. He had the wisdom to know that slavery was wrong and that eventually there would be war. Our nation owes much to this child of the enlightenment who understood the corrosive effect political power can have on the church and vice versa.
He also has my all time favorite quote on political opinion:
“Every difference of opinion is not a difference of principle.”
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TJ should have written emancipation into the declaration like Robert E. Lee’s grandaddy (great-grandad?) wanted him to. Might have kept the ensuing kerfuffle a tad smaller.
Kim, that is scary, I worry my BFF’s husband may cause her bodily harm. He is a functioning alcoholic (works all day, drinks to a stupor at night). She hides in her room because the more drunk he gets the more everything bad in his life is her fault. Both my husband and I have talked with her about leaving him. She is afraid he would go off the deep end. She thinks her kids would hate her (they are all adults) and she thinks the church would put her out. Is it just me or has there been an increase in domestic violence? Praying for your friend Kim.
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Donna,
Loved the story. I have a post ready to go, but I wanted to make sure you were OK with it first. Let me know.
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So, Allen, did you read the paper this morning?
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Thanks for the link AJ I will send it to Sawgunner.
Kim, bad situation. I’m sure he knows that if he kills her, it’s life in prison for him. I can’t imagine such a mind.
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Linda,
Nope. 🙂
It was a good game though. Much better than watching Obama, that’s for sure. 😉
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It was an awesome game. We tried to get tickets to it last week but it was sold out. We suspect that the Cal Ripken thing was originally intentionally scheduled late in the season to get fans to come out even though the Birds were (supposedly going to be) in last place.
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These comments about husbands killing their wives is creeping me out because I’m in the middle of reading “Dead by Sunset,” which is a true story of that exact thing happening (and the subsequent effort to convict the killer).
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Linda,
I did see some of the Ripken festivities on the MLB Network. They kept it classy, which is fitting, since Ripken is too.
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I can’t understand the idea of men killing wives. They could just leave, lots do.
As for insurance, it’s usually the men who carry insurance. I had hundreds of thousands on me (term) while Elvera had a couple of thousand.
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I sent the link to Sawgunner, BTW.
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Chas, I suspect we’re talking about sick, controlling personalities that you and I will never understand. At least that’s the case with the guy (Brad Cunningham) in the book I’m reading.
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Speaking of violent men…
R has not yet turned violent towards E (yet), but his behavior is classic for eventually becoming a physical abuser. Right now he’s “only” a verbal abuser.
I have told you all some of the stuff he’s done, but there’s much more I haven’t told. One of the things that points to him becoming violent some day is the fact that he did damage to each of the 3 apartments they’d lived in, in fits of anger.
We also all believe he is an alcoholic.
Now he has a gun permit.
And yes, that worries me.
Lately, things have not been too rosy between E & R. From what I saw him post on one of E’s Facebook posts, he’s back to accusing her of stuff, & being a jerk.
E & F have spent the last couple nights here.
Prayers welcome!
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As Linda says about the above-mentioned men, R is certainly a controlling personality.
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Revelation 9
New International Version (NIV)
The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss. 2 When he opened the Abyss, smoke rose from it like the smoke from a gigantic furnace. The sun and sky were darkened by the smoke from the Abyss. 3 And out of the smoke locusts came down on the earth and were given power like that of scorpions of the earth. 4 They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any plant or tree, but only thle who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads. 5 They were not allowed to kill them but only to torture them for five months. And the agony they suffered was like that of the sting of a scorpion when it strikes. 6 During those days people will seek death but will not find it; they will long to die, but death will elude them.
7 The locusts looked like horses prepared for battle. On their heads they wore something like crowns of gold, and their faces resembled human faces. 8 Their hair was like women’s hair, and their teeth were like lions’ teeth. 9 They had breastplates likre breastplates of iron, and the sound of their wings was like the thundering of many horses and chariots rushing into battle. 10 They had tails with stingers, like scorpions, and in their tails they had power to torment people for five months. 11 They had as king over them the angel of the Abyss, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon and in Greek is Apollyon (that is, Destroyer).
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the passage from Revelation is from me.
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Karen O,
I was going to suggest that you should read “Dead by Sunset” but on second thought, it would probably scare the crap out of you. I have to admit that I’ve been thinking about E’s situation as I am reading it.
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I can’t imagine men killing their wives either, but I personally know (knew) three women killed by their husbands/boyfriend. One gal I grew up with. The man was never convicted though a National Park Ranger (she was thrown off a cliff) and a neighbor did all they could to that end. The guy was unsucessful in going after his wife’s inheirtance which was considerable.
The other one was my sister’s best friend. Husband tired to make it look like a suicide and got away with it. Ex-husband was able to step in and get the insurance money turned over to her parents.
The other gal went to our church years ago. She was trying to break up with a guy she had discovered was a control freak. He is in jail for quite a long time.
KarenO you have my prayers! My friend’s husband has been physical with her three times. Pinning her down, throwing things at her, he forcefully grabbed her once but their 6’5″ son broke it up. But it is his guns and his drinking that scare me most of all.
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Prayers for those situations. As we teach more and more in our society that we are free to scratch whatever itches we have, we will see more and more abuse. Self control in many areas is laughed at more and more. Judith Reisman, Ph. D. writes about the affect of so-called ‘soft’ porn in her book “Soft Porn Plays Hardball”. More and more we see the affects of the playboy mentality, including in women who are now also filling their minds with garbage. People are to be used for whatever WE want when We want it. Stand in my way and I will do what I want to reinforce it, even if it leaves me in jail or dead, too. Like little children who never grow up.
Kim, I suspect that woman is mainly afraid and she should be, but she needs to reach out for help from others who have been there. She needs to be an example to her children that they can also leave those kinds of situations should the need arise. It is not loving on her part for them or for her abuser. Why should he change? She gives him no reason. If she leaves it may be a catalyst for that. If not, it is his choice.
Be careful. Abusers often take others down with the one they are really after.
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I am afraid that I would go to general quarters and send a man to “promised land” if I saw him beating a woman. Guess I am an old fossil when it comes to things like this, but nothing gets so angry as to see or read about either a woman or a child being assaulted.
😡
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I can’t understand why a woman would stay with such a man. I know some are physically dependent. But there must be someplace to go. I can’t imagine living in such turmoil. Day and night. There will never be an end to it.
Don’t announce that you are leaving. Just go.
If you have a will , see a lawyer first.
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Linda – I’ve seen enough of these kinds of stories on Dateline or 20/20. 😉
Since R blames us for much of the situation, I wouldn’t be surprised to see him show up here with his gun. Hopefully, it will never come to that.
Knowing that we are in God’s hands gives me peace.
R’s family still has no idea about any of the stuff he’s done. E has said in the past that she doesn’t want me going to his mom with the story. But now that a gun has entered the picture, I’m wondering if I should anyway.
Who would want to hear such awful things about their own son? And would she even believe me?
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Chas, a lot of them are also emotionally dependent. They have come to believe the lies that they are worthless and he is the only one who will take them in. They believe they deserve the bad treatment. Some believe that that is the way men treat women and it just is. Others believe he will track them down and do worse. It is not easy for most to leave the situation, impossible for some unless God intervenes.
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Karen,
Prayers for you and your family. That’s a hard situation for all involved.
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Good Morning, Y’all!
I’m afraid I fall in the same old fogey category as drivesguy. I would probably go to jail myself for completely losing it on a man who is coward enough to hurt a woman.
Spending my days in a public high school daily reminds me of the lessons that are not being taught to our youth…I do what I can, but to be honest it’s a losing fight.
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After a lot of reading Scripture and thinking, someone close to me has concluded the less moral society becomes, the more laws it requires to function.
In the New Testament we learn as we grow closer to the last days, restraints are removed and we’re allowed to become as evil as we like. Look around. When evil is declared good and those who follow God’s moral law are lampooned, something is wrong with your society
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Great quote from Jefferson.
I really appreciate your Jefferson quote and post, CB and I agree that there is a very corrosive effect that power and control (political or personal) has on the controller. The church is not immune to this temptation and this same principle of sin is at work in the controlling and abusive husband.
I don’t mean to over spiritualize this, but it seems that not being in a position of power sometimes helps to keep us lowly in spirit where we can avail ourselves to Christ’s love, mercy and eventual justice. My prayers are for the women who are being abused and for their abusers.
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Karen, Kim, et al, praying. Those are sad situations.
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Creepy how many of us know situations like that. I have an In-law who has always suspected that her father had something to do with her mother’s “suicide”. He was police officer and there was no investigation.
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Please understand that my previous post was in no way meant to minimize abuse to women. Instead, the last paragraph was meant as an attempt to find a silver lining in a dismal situation. Both the abused and the abuser are the victims of the evil one.
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I see where a local narc detective received a text from a guy wanting to sell him some drugs. They agreed to meet. The guy was arrested, the girl with him was arrested. It was a wrong number. Oops.
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Mumsee, the obvious lesson:
Don’t sell drugs Don’t text to the wrong number. 😉
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That didn’t work. Trying again.
The obvious lesson:
Don’t sell drugsDon’t text to the wrong number.LikeLike
Praying my way through this thread today…what sad situations. Karen O, you have my continued prayers for your family.
I had a cousin who died of undetermined causes at the age of 48. Her husband found her collapsed in their home. She had been healthy and in good physical shape, having competed in many triathlons. After her death, he began acting very mysteriously and wanted nothing to do with her family. He would not speak to her parents, and they could not figure out why.
Some in the extended family have wondered if he had something to do with her death, given his strange behavior afterward. Her autopsy was inconclusive, so we will probably never know what happened.
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I also think that the children are a big part of it. If a woman wants to leave, she needs to either leave them behind (a terrible choice) or take them with her. The latter is sometimes financially impossible and always brings a whole boatload of other issues with it because they are his children, too, and he still has legal rights relating to them. They will be the means by which he can harass her forever.
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Six Arrows, it is quite possible that the man did not want contact with the family because he felt guilty for her death. Though he had no hand in it. My sister died about that age and it was very difficult on my brother in law, with thoughts of “if only I had taken her to the doctor earlier…, etc”
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It is sad to read of so many suffering women. If their lives were ended by the men, then you know that was just the ultimate point in their suffering. They may have suffered for years. It is such a tragedy that men are not taught or else do not retain their early teachings (in some cases) about the value of life. At least it is illegal here for the men to do such things to women. I also consider all the women in the world who are under Sharia law. Also there are all those ladies in China who are forced into having abortions against their will. And to think our government basically looks the other way as it hands out taxpayers money.
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I have not been paying attention enough, I guess. What is going on with Karen? Who is “R?” Karen, are you safe?
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Sort of hate to break it to all of you, though I am sure that all of you are well immunized against it, and will not fall into despair (unless you are all already there).
This is all there is. The universe and earth is all there is. The empirical world around us is it. The only meaning we find is the meaning we create. “God” is a creation of human beings. So make sure you create a kind, gentle, and loving God if you must create an imaginary being.
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My reality is I need to get off the Internet and clean the you know what out of the chicken coop. I hope today is not the day the Cascade Fault decides to hiccup and clean my wife me out of the island with an earthquake and a tsunami. Pray and pass the ammunition. Pray today is not the day my Alzheimer’s passes critical mass and I stop making sense.
Oh.
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modestypress, somehow your post sounds like a god giving his children godly advice. By doing so, it seems you are deeming yourself higher and more godly than the rest of us. Hmmm…it sort of defeats the point of your suggestion.
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Mumsee, thank you, yes, that could be true. I hadn’t thought about how her husband’s feelings following her death could possibly produce such a change in relationship with his in-laws. It’s easy to think of worst-case scenarios when an apparently healthy person dies unexpectedly without anyone witnessing it. It’s possible she could have had a heart arrhythmia or something like that that wouldn’t show up on an autopsy.
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Janice, your observation is correct; this fellow appears to have taken the divinity from God and Christ and given it to himself.
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Random, no Karen is not safe, but she is aware and trying. R is the son in law who has not been doing the best for daughter. Daughter has left him in the past but recently went back to him and he is acting in a disturbing fashion again. Violence is a concern.
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Random,
There is such a thing as objective truth. That philosophy requires a first cause, therefore I believe in a creator God not a created god. That’s the fundamental difference between us…
Also…if God is imaginary why would it matter if you imagined him kind and gentle?
On a lighter note…why does a chicken coop always have two doors?
Because if it had 4 it would be a chicken sedan….ba dump bump chhh
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BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!
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A lighter note. At our Lions meeting today, our program was a visiting conductor for the Hendersonville symphony. Very good. He was born and reared in LA. Has worked with many of the well known actors. Was in the children’s marching band in the finale of “The Music Man” and worked with Jack Benny and Elvis. What I came here to say was that as a boy he was in little league baseball. His coach was Burt Lancaster. Burt’s son, Robert played on the team. Robert did something important, but I forgot what.
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He says he still gets residuals for his part with Elvis. Every year they send him a check for about $1.25.
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Karen, do you have a dog? If not get one now. A pit bull preferably. R will not try anything if a pit bull is guarding you, your daughter and the grand children. My daughter lived with a family that had a female pit bull call Honey. Honey never trusted the paramecium that would come to visit her on occasion. When the paramecium would sit down next to my daughter, the dog would get between them and snarl at the paramecium. When the paramecium met me, he knew full well the consequence if he ever laid a hand on my daughter.
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I didn’t have any real knowledge of spousal abuse until my niece ended up married to an abuser. He had not shown any of the warning signs prior to their marriage. About 6 months into the marriage he started hitting her. She did not say anything to anyone for about a year, but she lived in fear and had hiding places. She would have stayed with him except that everyone, including her pastor, told her to get out. Her husband had NO remorse and told the counselor that she was his wife and he would beat if he wanted.
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To clarify about my friend…she caught her husband cheating. She asked him to leave. They are divorced and both remarried (a convoluted story). She already only meets him in parking lots with video cameras but they other day he attacked her new husband. Currently she is checking in with her attorney’s office each time she changes locations and has scheduled times to check in for safety.
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Mumsee, thank you for the update on Karen. I am glad she is taking precautions. I hope she is all right.
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modestypress, somehow your post sounds like a god giving his children godly advice. By doing so, it seems you are deeming yourself higher and more godly than the rest of us. Hmmm…it sort of defeats the point of your suggestion.
Janice, will you marry me?
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MP,Random, if you are right then I will die, after having lived a better life than my natural self would have lived, and never know the difference. I think I will stick with what I have.
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modestypress, no, I won’t marry you. Many reasons come to mind for the rejection. First, I am already married. Secondly, I am not a goddess (a god deserves a goddess, and I think you probably already have one). Third, I honor God and His one man one wife institution. These are not in order of priority, but I am sure you get the gist.
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Where is Cheryl? I don’t think I’ve seen her the last couple days.
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Where or where could Cheryl be? Not here that’s for sure. Don’t worry. She is OK and will be back soon.
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Well, that was quick. I’m married also, and although we are 80% incompatible, after 46 years, my wife figures she has me broken in. Do you have your spouse well trained? On the other hand, my daughter and her partner have been together for 20 years, and we are hoping that the homosexual marriage law in Washington state survives the repeal effort, so they can make honest women of each other, and so AE (our granddaughter with two mommies in Seattle and two daddies in Chicago) can be a bridesmaid at her mommies’ wedding. She will look so cute, and if I live long enough, I expect to see her married some day to both a boy and a girl, just as God intended in this science fiction time.
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Hey guys and gals! I actually added something to my blog. I would post it here but those who don’t like sports might not want to scroll past it. So, if the NFL is you thing, try this little quiz while enjoying your favorite NFL team this weekend.
NFL names in other words
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I went back & saw Sawgunner on yesterday’s thread. He asked about “2016, the Movie”. I’ve already told you, but I’ll say again.
I saw “2016, Obama’s America” a couple of weeks ago. It’s an interesting movie, but I didn’t learn anything because I had already read both Dreams from My Father and Roots of Obama’s Rage. The movie is taken from those two books. The interview with George was new, and interesting, I thought. It was interesting to see the scenes from Kenya.
You will learn something, and it will be well worth the money and 87 minutes.
I think everyone should see it.
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Funny thing about “2016”. It’s been at the Epic theater over two weeks now. It’s never mentioned in the entertainment section of the paper along with other movies. It’s a stealth hit. I had to go onto the internet to find it.
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Sawgunner- I saw “2016” last week. It was a horror flick in documentary clothing. I “hope” we get a “change” in leadership so we can go “forward” with economic improvements.
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Peter L ,
As a non sports commenter, I am always pleased to see you folk discussing sports. It is good to have discussions outside of the pressing issues. Not that sports is not a pressing issue, of course. Having them on here is not a problem to me at all. Go Boise.
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modestypress, I hope your daughter and her partner and any children who live with them are finding some happiness and peace in their arrangements. I do feel badly for those of that persuation that their feelings get hurt because a majority of the people in our nation do not want to call their type of a relationship a marriage. A society becomes very chaotic when words have no meaning. It is like each person is becoming a god to determine what particular words mean. I submit to the meaning of marriage as prescribed by the God of the Bible. He has very high standards for marriage or Holy Matrimony. Lesser gods have lesser standards. It won’t ever be the same no matter how many times same sex couples walk down the aisle together. They can call it marriage. It is not the same in the eyes of the God of the Bible. There is not much use in continuing in a discussion of definitions based on differing points of view. I don’t expect to change your mind and neither should you expect to change my mind. I do hope for the happiness of your family and I also hope that they might all (including you) know the joy of the Lord before the end of life.
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Yes, I do have a dog. Heidi is half Pit Bull & half Miniature Schnauzer. (Yes, really. Everyone wonders how they managed to mate, but they did.) She is very, very sweet & exuberant, so if R managed to get in the house, she’d jump all over him & try to kiss him.
But first, before she’d know who it was, she’d be barking her dang fool head off. That would at least alert us that there was something to check out.
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Interesting read. How we ‘build that’, a letter to the editor written in response to Joel Belz’s column “He meant what he said” from the Aug. 25 issue of WORLD Magazine.
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Tomorrow we’re meeting up with 2nd Arrow for a picnic about halfway between where we live and she now lives. She doesn’t have to work tomorrow, and will be taking a break from her homework for a few hours to get together. My sister-in-law and niece, with whom our daughter lives now while attending school, will also be joining us. Should be a nice little reunion. If I don’t check in here tomorrow, have a good day everyone!
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How much money does your church collect each Sunday?
How much did it cost to build your church?
Three probable reasons humans devised religion: We don’t care to die. Who does? We are animals. Animals strive to survive; otherwise no species would pass its genes on. Second, life is not fair. Wicked often prosper; virtuous often suffer. Natural to imagine a system where we don’t die, good is rewarded, and evil is punished. Third, we are social animals. We evolved as pack/flock creatures. We gather in churches and temples and tell each other. “Be good. You will not die. You will be rewarded. And you will get the joy (to pass the eternities in Heaven) of watching the wicked writhe and burn in Hell.”
Given how strong the urge to believe this wishful thinking is in our genome, it’s kind of amazing that atheism and empiricism ever arose, and not surprising that it’s a little lonely to be an atheist. It has been clumsily argued that an embryo replicates human evolutionary development, I observe that secular social networks replicate church developments. Early churches met informally and surreptitiously, providing “safe places” for people to worship their imaginary God. Secularists (such as the group I started) are meeting in small groups like little churches, feeling a little less lonely.
It’s also interesting to me that a woman in the group that met last night spoke of how she could feel (when young) an intense mystical feeling where she thought she was communicating with God. “I could turn this feeling on when I wanted to. It was very pleasurable. I wanted to feel the experience. As I got older, it became harder to experience it.” I suspect that her rational analysis also struggled with her genetic urging to believe as she grew older.
Not everyone at our meeting agreed on every point, but there was considerable excitement and enthusiasm as people realized they were among fellow “non-believers.”
“Boy, this sounds a bit like a revival meeting,” I commented at one point. We don’t pass an offering plate, but I did auction a dozen eggs. I collected $3. They trusted me with it. I should carefully put the money away somewhere and keep it separated from my personal money, for when we need to build a heresy house or a religion-less refuge
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I am reading a book called How They Croaked: the Awful Ends of the Awfully Famous.. I don’t know anything about the author, but from Amazon Reviews it seems aimed at children of about ten and eleven years of age. I have seen children of 3-5 doing little role plays of Christ’s crucifixion and resurrection in a church. The battle for little minds is on. The atheists say, “You’re going to die, kid. Deal with it.”
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I am glad you have a dog Karen O. I am also sure that should she sense that R was there on other than honorable intentions, she would not hesitate to attack him. Dog’s are in some ways a better judge of people than people are.
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