I think this bipartisan report may encapsulate the centrist position better than any I’ve seen in a while. What do the centrists here think?
“The bipartisan committee charged with supporting democracy and human rights in post-Soviet states is pushing for the United States to dump the post-Cold War status quo in its relations with Russia and label Moscow as a “persistent” threat to global security.
The report from the Helsinki Commission, which was obtained by The Hill ahead of publication, argues that Washington must reframe its thinking in how it approaches Russia, as it has with China over the past few years, and allocate resources accordingly.
A priority focus of the report’s strategy is to ensure Ukraine’s victory in its defensive war against Russia, calling for “massive” military and humanitarian assistance for Kyiv and allowing Ukraine’s armed forces to strike deep into Russia with U.S. provided weapons. …
~ “Social media became a pox on your house because the media was a pox on everyone else’s.
Own it. Your industry is responsible for the rise of X.” ~
Or the people who disagree with the mainstream media could have chosen to pursue good, in-depth reporting rather than posting that hair-on-fire crap.
“He hit me first!” doesn’t work with most parents. If the mainstream media is so bad, then those others should have “hit back” with good journalism, not the quotes-and-videos-taken-out-of-context stuff that seems to permeate X.
BTW, DJ does not have to “own it.” She and other good reporters are doing the best they can in an increasingly hostile environment.
Debra – Regarding what you commented last night about centrists being war-mongers. There is a big difference between acknowledging that sometimes military action may be necessary and being a war-monger.
As for what centrists believe, I don’t think there is a one-size-fits-all stance among them. My guess would be that they fall into the stance of military action sometimes being necessary rather than seeing war as the answer to any situation.
(Not sure if I am a “centrist”. Are “moderates” the same thing? I have tended to call myself a moderate, or a conservative-leaning moderate. )
Look, having a strong defense is a deterrent to war. No one here wants war. War is horrible. Sometimes it is necessary. You’re living in a dream world if you can’t see that and understand the distinction.
We have an army size number of unknowns who have come across our borders for many years but mostly in the last three and a half. Will Ukraine help us to defend ourselves when we have a need?
You’re now the minority in the R party, and you sound more like Democrats every day. This “centrist” or “moderate”, which is just another word for leans liberal, position in today’s climate is a losing position. Sadly, your inability to see this and accept it, will lead to Democrats winning in all likelihood. You know this, but you don’t seem to care, yet wonder why you take flack for sitting on the fence.
Kizzie,
Do you deny the media has put themselves in the position they’re in?
While Dj may be a fine local reporter, that does nothing for the horrible shape the media as a whole is in right now. They chose a side, they’re clearly biased, lie repeatedly, push dem talking points as fact, and do little more than propagandize and gaslight the nation. Perhaps if the media policed their own, things could be different. Yet you rarely if ever hear of local folks calling out the bias and trash the national media puts out. These are facts. You may not like them, but you can do little to refute them.
This idea that somehow there’s this squishy middle that the majority occupy is laughable. You have very little in common with Dems, they mock and ridicule your faith and brethren, yet you think folks should join such people as if there’s much common ground to be had. Dems bank on you NTers, and you all seem intent on delivering for them once again.
Is there middle ground on abortion? No.
On illegals invading? No.
On foreign policy? No.
On economic issues? No.
Spending? No.
The Gay/Trans agenda? No.
The mutilation of teenage genitals? No.
It’s only in the minds of the kumbaya crowd that this notion even exists.
I could go on, but why bother, lest I be accused of being mean.
Debra, no one here is a “war monger” or supports war “mongering.” That is just unfair (as is taking the term “class” and making it something it’s not, but that’s a minor and rather silly point).
Being wise and knowing that we do not live in a “friendly” world but in a fallen (and often dangerous) world means realizing that war sometimes is necessary. It’s really common sense. No one wants war.
Elon is right, and the fence sitters hate that, because they know it too.
I think deep down folks like you two have already surrendered as a result of living in occupied terroritory. It’s pushed you left and you don’t even realize it.
You think there’s common ground on this? While you dither and hand wring over the Bad Orange Man, Dems scheme and build their desired one party rule future. Trump would stop this, but you don’t care, cuz you don’t like him.
“Very few Americans realize that, if Trump is NOT elected, this will be the last election. Far from being a threat to democracy, he is the only way to save it!
Let me explain: if even 1 in 20 illegals become citizens per year, something that the Democrats are expediting as fast as humanly possible, that would be about 2 million new legal voters in 4 years.
The voting margin in the swing states is often less than 20 thousand votes. That means if the “Democratic” Party succeeds, there will be no more swing states!!
Moreover, the Biden/Harris administration has been flying “asylum seekers”, who are fast-tracked to citizenship, directly into swing states like Pennsylvania, Ohio, Wisconsin and Arizona. It is a surefire way to win every election.
America then becomes a one-party state and Democracy is over. The only “elections” will be the Democratic Party primaries. This already happened in California many years ago, following the 1986 amnesty.
The only thing holding California back from extreme socialism and suffocating government policies is that people can leave California and still remain in America. Once the whole country is controlled by one party, there will be no escape.
Everywhere in America will be like the nightmare that is downtown San Francisco.”
You forgot the Trump tariffs were continued by Harris-Biden, there was no recession, real wages were up, the stock market did well, record low unemployment pre-pandemic — it’s weird to act like he’s a wildcard.”
“POLITICAL VIOLENCE: Nevada Democrats have hung a 43 foot tall, 6000 pound naked President Trump in effigy near Las Vegas on Interstate 15. The display cost $550K+ It is designed to incite violence against and on behalf of the former president. “
“Nightmarish, deadly disaster zones across 5 states. Many millions without power. Thousands missing or presumed dead. Kamala completely paralyzed. Media silent because chaos is bad optics for the regime. They spent hundreds of billions in Ukraine – won’t lift a finger for America.”
Hey, I’m not even clutching my pearls! (Where are those pearls, anyway?) These are tired and unfair – not particularly even serious anymore – attacks via our new-world social media and group-think responses to serious issues we can’t seem to discuss here anymore.
And the media will of course follow her orders, like dutiful little lap dogs. The latest lies may even get some of them Pulitzers, just like last time!
“Hillary Clinton says “something will happen” in October, compares herself to the Greek mythological figure Cassandra & launches another Russian conspiracy theory.
Clinton called on the media to report only negative things about Trump to change Americans’ minds.
“People need to be woken up and given the facts about what he has done is saying and would do.”
“I anticipate that something will happen in October, as it always does. You know, the Russians, as I said earlier, are very active in this election.”
“We know the Iranians are active as well. Chinese uses TikTok, or they certainly did against Biden and for Trump.”
“But I anticipate there will be a full court press in October. The digital airwaves will be filled.”
“Meet Betsy Packard, an instructor at @UKarts_sciences. She appears to celebrate Hurricane Helene destroying cities because some of those towns are Republican.
Does @UKarts_sciences also believe this? Do they condone these messages?”
“Tim Walz gets heckled by students at the Michigan game and then appears to flip off the students. Really showing his ex-teacher, vice presidential maturity getting rattled by some college kids. Weak!”
“Privately owned helicopters are delivering supplies to stranded victims as the government is “nowhere to be found” after Hurricane Helene demolished the Southeast.
Locals are volunteering their time and money to help Americans in need.
“Today, myself and my family cooked three pans of hot food to send across the [Nolichucky] river to those stranded due to the failure of all but one bridge in our region,” said one TikTok user.
The user, ‘cayotecowgirl,’ is located in Greeneville, Tennessee.
“Three pans of food to help feed what we would find out was over 1500 evacuees. Upon reaching the relief hub that had been set up, we were informed that aside from the state troopers, highway department, and first responders on the scene, absolutely no government help has been offered.”
“The helicopters delivering supplies across the river are privately owned and funded, pilots volunteering their own time, machines, and fuel.”
“The cases of water, baby formula, diapers, and food are paid for by those that have banded together to form a relief effort.”
“Our governors, politicians, town officials are NOWHERE to be found. Where is the coverage?? Where is the aid?? I am incredibly proud of the community I call home…”
This kind of disastrous foreign policy needs to die a slow, painful death. This is why establishment types love it so, it benefits their donors, and their stock portfolios.
“RFK Jr: “Why are we in all these wars? … Here’s the reason why.”
“When a new nation enters NATO, the contract requires it to conform its weapons purchases to NATO specifications, which means billions and billions of dollars for Lockheed, Northrop Grumman, Boeing, General Dynamics and the other military contractors.
Who owns all of those? One company: BlackRock. These are the people who are dictating what the Democratic Party does.””
—–
And the establishment shills on the right play along gleefully….
AJ, I do hope you take some time to search out and read some of the newer online political sites that aim to take seriously and treat “both” sides of many of these issues. (Assuming you actually do miss real journalism.) You won’t see that generally on social media, especially not on “X.”
“This is the most VEEP-like photo ever — pretending to be on a phone call but forgetting to plug in the antiquated earphones while pretending to write on a blank piece of paper instead of actually doing anything.”
Just sayin’ since you seem to hate one-sided journalism, you might want to leave “X” (which isn’t journalism, but it is one-sided) from time to time to search out some more ideas and try to understand the arguments. I mean, if you truly want to at least visit some better sources. They do exist! 🙂
“In one of the most jaw-dropping Friday-afternoon news dumps of all time, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement revealed that the agency’s docket included more than 662,000 illegal immigrants who either had a criminal conviction or were awaiting a verdict in a criminal case, including more than 13,000 convicted murderers, more than 15,000 convicted of sexual assault, more than 2,500 convicted of kidnapping, and more than 62,000 convicted of assault.”
Well, AJ, I am sure that folks on the left think that “centrist” or “moderate” mean leaning right. In fact, I have been accused and dismissed by folks on both sides for “obviously” being on the other side. There is too much of an attitude of “If you don’t completely agree with my side then you must be on the other side” on both far sides of the spectrum.
Don’t be too sure that DJ and I are in the minority among general Republicans. As that article yesterday mentioned, the majority of folks on each side are not on the far edges, but more on an actual spectrum of stances.
Even if we do turn out to be in a losing position, our mutual faith tells us that the winning position is not necessarily the right one. Throughout history, “the majority” has often been wrong, but that was not realized until later. And remember, the results of the election are ultimately in God’s hands, so if Harris wins, take it up with Him.
“You know this, but you don’t seem to care, yet wonder why you take flack for sitting on the fence.”
You keep telling DJ and me that we don’t care, or similar accusations, because we dare to have a different view. I can assure you that we do care – very much – we just see things differently. I have prayed, and are praying, about all of this, and care very deeply. But I will not be bullied or shamed into following the “approved blog view”. (And apparently, neither will DJ.)
That there are problems with the mainstream media does not mean that other media can be just as bad (or worse) but in their own way. Continuing my comparison to kids fighting, parents used to say (and I’m sure many still do), “I don’t care what Jimmy did. You’re supposed to know better than that.”
For all those questions you asked to which you answered “No”, in reality, there are those on the left who do in fact disagree to one degree or another with those things.
And for the record, we are not dithering and handwringing.
“Kamala used every available government resource to airlift and evacuate 500 thousand Haitian illegals to the United States. But she couldn’t lift a finger to rescue drowning Americans in Asheville”
Meanwhile she’s dining comfortably at a fundraiser.”
~ A few weeks ago, just after Robert Kennedy Jr.’s endorsement of Donald Trump, Matt Yglesias wrote an essay on what he called “the crank realignment” — the recent migration of a lot of conspiratorial, tinfoil-hatted and outsider-knowledge-oriented elements in American politics toward the populist right, and the consolidation of most educated professionals and academics within the Democratic coalition.
This trend is one of the most important developments of the Trump era, and I appreciated Yglesias’s attempt to distill the problems that it creates for both coalitions. For the right, there’s a basic competence and human capital problem, because a paranoid populism repels a lot of intelligent people whom you would need to actually create or sustain a conservative establishment, which in turn makes it hard, as Yglesias writes, “to actually marshal knowledge and govern the country.” (The party that nominates someone like Mark Robinson for governor of North Carolina is not exactly advertising its seriousness or competence.) For the left, there’s a problem that “turning fields like journalism, social science and public health into partisan monocultures makes it harder for them to perform their epistemic functions,” because without any conservative leaven they fall prey much too easily to groupthink and confirmation bias. … ~
He continues: ~ I want to go a bit further into both sides’ struggles. First, on the right, the problem isn’t just that talented people are marginalized under these conditions, it’s that even when talented people do rise to positions of influence and power, they’re often still caught up in the vortex of conspiratorial impulses, Manichaelan thinking and dubious ideas.
… Thus a character like Elon Musk, for instance, is one of the most dynamic and creative figures in the world, no matter what his haters say, but you wouldn’t know it from a lot of his right-leaning social media engagement. And Vance himself, who is as capable at arguing about public policy as any Republican candidate in my lifetime, has staff members who were out trying to validate rumors about cat-eating migrants because those are the stories that Trump and the right-wing have in mind to tell … ~
There are literally a gazillion media options on X, including many liberal ones. Your feed is determined by who you follow. It is what you make it. If your feed isn’t to your liking, try other sources.
Also, it’s ironic that many of your preferred sources fled X because there were just too many Trump people. They couldn’t tolerate opposition voices, so they fled to the safety of liberal echo chambers, where their lies and BS wouldn’t be called out. Trumpers aren’t their targeted audience anyway, right? They weren’t looking to change minds anyway, just suck in income from the true believers who actually buy their rubbish.
~ Second, the power of crankishness on the right is a problem even when the cranks are correct. Overall, I tend to have more sympathy for fringe ideas than some mainstream newspaper columnists. I think that some conspiracy theories are connected to overlooked realities. I’m confident that the paranormal and supernatural are more important aspects of reality than most secular observers recognize. My experience with chronic illness persuaded me that some forms of strange outsider knowledge in medicine have a lot to offer.
But if you have undiscovered or underreported truths out there, moving them from the fringe to the center is a challenging undertaking. Even when they’re world-historically important, as with the world’s mounting birthrate crisis, the stink of weirdness can be awfully hard to shake. And it becomes that much more challenging when they’re part of a larger sea of ideologically motivated credulity, such that the same guy who is saying Weird Thing X (which might well turn out to be true) is also saying Weird Things P and Q and R (which are false or just insane).
Unfortunately, it’s a characteristic human tendency to discover that the official narrative is wrong about some important thing and then leap to the conclusion that it must be wrong about absolutely everything. I found this to be true time and again in my journeys on the medical fringe, where I would find a practitioner or author with some key insight or discovery who had become far too credulous about any and all anti-establishment ideas. And now it’s true in right-wing politics, as well, which makes it hard to take the fringe-but-possibly-true ideas that show up on Joe Rogan’s show or in a Tucker Carlson interview and separate them from the ideas that are fringe-and-simply-false.
Now let’s talk about liberalism’s problems in this landscape. … ~
Yglesias is a little too quick to say that the crank realignment has made liberal politics “less friendly to nut jobs,” full stop. Rather, it’s made liberal politics less friendly to certain fringe ideas that used to have more of a home inside the liberal tent — vaccine skepticism, Michael Moore-style foreign policy analysis, etc. — but arguably more vulnerable to the forms of ideological fanaticism and flimflam that remain.
That is, as crankishness has become more right-coded, it’s become easier for liberals to assume that if some idea isn’t right-coded it can’t be crankish or fanatical or kooky. The rise of various antiracist guru figures during the Great Awokening, the elevation of hucksters like Robin DiAngelo and Tema Okun (about whom Yglesias has written perceptively) to undeserved prominence in progressive thought and institutions, was enabled by some of these assumptions — that the right is inherently extreme and the left is inherently reality-based and serious, so if left-leaning institutions are embracing weird-seeming ideas about “white supremacy culture,” well, they must have some sort of respectable intellectual foundation. (They don’t.) …
… Good causes no less than bad ones can be taken up by disturbed individuals. But it is a warning to a liberalism that imagines that having crankish enemies supplies some kind of immunity to extremism or folly. There is no such guarantee: You can have Kennedy as your political adversary and still discover, too late, that extremism in the defense of centrism can also be a vice. ~
“She couldn’t lift a finger to rescue drowning Americans in Asheville.” Really? What exactly did you expect her, or the Federal government, to do? Wave a magic wand?
As I recall George W Bush was widely criticized for what appeared to be a slow unfeeling response to Hurricane Katrina.
Trucks can’t get in because roads are washed out. FEMA is working with the Army Core of Engineers to begin rebuilding roads and bridges. Airlifts are being set up. This all takes time. It’s been less than three days since the storm ended.
I guess I am still trying to understand how the Centists or Modrrates here on the blog feel about the actual issues and not how they feel about AJ’s posts. I want to understand why they feel a certain different way than what is called here, “the majority.” We are such a small sample that I think it is not representative of the US population.
I always see quotes from others who are deemed more wise, more informed, more in tune with God, etc., but I don’t typically see much about the issues and why people see it as they do. Do we have globalists here? I am getting the impression that we do. Is that because you are trying to see the world as you think God sees it?
Speaking of Asheville, isn’t that where World Magazine offices are located?
Cheryl mentioned World Magazine late last night on yesterday’s News thread.
Hearing that Asheville NC was one of the areas hit hard by the storm, I googled to see if that included World’s headquarters. It does. Here’s an article from World that mentions it in passing.
“WORLD’s headquarters is located in the Biltmore Village area and suffered major damage. Andrew Belz, major gifts officer for WORLD, reported that both buildings had suffered several feet of flooding and windows had burst in at least one building.”
Thanks for reposting that, Kevin, and adding some additional updates. I’d seen Cheryl’s post late last night and I’m afraid it got lost in the ongoing political back-and-forth.
One of the Belz men is a pastor at a local PCA church. Wes knew him at Covenant. He saw him at the coffee shop at our nearby Toco Hills shopping plaza. I think the shop is named something like Spiller’s Corner 🙂
Janice, don’t think anyone here would claim the term “globalist.” We are interconnected with other nations, always have been (and will be even if we prefer isolationism). But I think the term “globalist” (politically) means something quite different, I’ve not researched it.
Isolationism – no; but rather, non-interventionism.
USA first, but not USA only. Our foreign policy should be what best advances the USA’s interests. Allies (such as NATO members) need to pay their fair share. Other nations are more likely to start wars when they don’t bear the full costs of those wars (i.e. they don’t bear the full burden of the risks that they take).
Under this administration it is perfectly clear the USA is not first on the list. It is their agenda no matter the cost to our citizenry. I don’t like war..who does? But I feel it is imperative to have a military strong and ready. We don’t….
The source (The Heritage Foundation) is more classic conservatism that will be rejected by some here, I realize, but I did find this piece on Isolationist vs. Noninterventionist. The author is probably correct in that a debate is needed to more clearly understand the terms.
Neither Isolationist nor Noninterventionist: The Right Way to Think About Foreign Policy
There is a lot of confusion about America’s proper role in the world at the moment. The terms “isolationism” and “noninterventionism” are often used without clear meaning. These two concepts do have specific definitions that should be properly understood, but we must also be aware of how these terms are being used. The stakes are high, and America cannot afford another deadly encounter with isolationism.
A debate is needed. How else can America’s principles be prudently applied to foreign policy? Disagreement over the merits of a particular war is not, in itself, indicative of rising isolationism in Republican ranks. Indeed, most people shun isolationism. But for the war-weary, it may sound tempting to embrace strict noninterventionism, even if they don’t wish for America to isolate itself from the world. The problem is that many arguments now masquerading as “noninterventionist” are actually isolationist and, as such, at odds with America’s principles and foreign policy traditions. …
… A noninterventionist policy is a particular policy of political or military noninvolvement in foreign relations or in other countries’ internal affairs. The United States has sometimes followed a short-term policy of nonintervention, more accurately termed “neutrality.” This began with George Washington’s Proclamation of Neutrality in 1793, which remained in force until naval hostilities broke out between the United States and Revolutionary France a few years later.
Modern advocates of so-called noninterventionism, however, often go far beyond a specific policy of nonintervention or neutrality and instead advocate an isolationist doctrine of strict noninterventionism, which prescribes that America should remain militarily uninvolved abroad except when there is a clear and imminent threat to U.S. territory. This understanding of noninterventionism is a key element of an isolationist grand strategy and stands at odds with the guiding principles of U.S. foreign policy going back to the early years of the Republic. …
… Whereas past disputes over war-making had involved individual situations, opponents of wars in the 20th century have increasingly begun to invoke a sweeping doctrine of noninterventionism. Several authors today advocate this truly isolationist doctrine, and many of these “noninterventionists” claim to represent the Founders’ foreign policy. According to Congressman Ron Paul (R–TX), for example, the United States should “return to the traditional U.S. foreign policy of…non-interventionism.”
Many Americans have fallen for this isolationist doctrine before. We must not do it again, even though the waters have been thoroughly muddied by partisan politics and frequent misuse of the terms “isolationism” and “noninterventionism.” …
… Americans did fall for an isolationist doctrine under the mantle of noninterventionism in the late 1930s and early 1940s; its disastrous effects culminated in the uncontested rise of Hitler’s Germany and the attack on Pearl Harbor. …
Elon is a class act. Despite the federal lawsuit against him, and the feds slow rolling approval for his rockets, he can be counted on to do the right thing.
He’s bringing the astronauts home, something our clueless govt can no longer accomplish, and now he’s aiding relief efforts.
“PROJECT 2025: A current and founding trustee of the Heritage Foundation, the group behind Project 2025, has endorsed Kamala Harris for president.
Former Congressman Mickey Edwards threw his support behind Harris, arguing she aligns better with many of the policies outlined in Project 2025, particularly on foreign policy.
Edwards emphasized the danger of authoritarian regimes like China, Russia, and North Korea, suggesting they could manipulate a Trump administration through flattery, making Harris a stronger candidate in safeguarding American interests.”
—–
The people endlessly pushing war will side with whoever seems most likely to give them what they want. They’re conniving opportunists who sway with the wind. That’s the problem with ’em. They can only sell it if people buy it. More and more aren’t, thankfully. Trump threatens their status quo, and relevance. I’d fear him too, we’re I them.
The Broadband Equity Access and Deployment Program, or BEAD, has not connected a single rural home to high-speed internet service since Mr. Biden signed the funding into law in November 2021.
At the current pace of distributing the funds, high-speed internet connections to most of the rural areas intended to benefit from BEAD won’t be completed until 2030. The Commerce Department, which is in charge of the program, said none of the projects will begin until 2025 or 2026.
Mr. Musk’sSpaceX is excluded from the BEAD federal subsidies because the money is reserved for companies deploying fiber-optic cable, which the government views as a more proven technology than satellite connections.
During the Trump administration, SpaceX was on track to receive $885.5 million from a different federal program to provide internet to rural locations. The Democratic-led Federal Communications Commission canceled the SpaceX award in August 2022.
Starlink satellites are already proving themselves in a lot of areas. I have a coworker in rural Maryland who works from home using Starlink. Musk is getting it done, federal subsidies or not. How shortsighted not to partner with him. How ironic for FEMA to need Starlink now.
“Last year, the FCC upheld its 2022 decision to deny SpaceX’s @Starlink an $885 million subsidy to bring broadband to 642,000 Americans living in rural areas. FCC Chair Jessica Rosenworcel didn’t think Starlink could deliver the promised service.
Today, Starlink is connecting over 7,700 new customers per day, FEMA is sending Starlink terminals to help victims in North Carolina due to Hurricane Helene, and the world’s largest airlines are signing contracts to outfit their entire fleets with it. It has proven to be a reliable and fast service for millions of users.
The FCC had program requirements that Starlink didn’t have to meet until 2025, yet the FCC Chair was unfairly making a prediction about whether Starlink would meet them or not years before the deadline. Starlink needed to show that it was more likely than not that it could provide high-speed Internet service (low-latency, 100/20 Mbps service) to at least 40% of the 642,000 rural premises by Dec 31, 2025. Starlink did that.
So why revoke that $885M award? It doesn’t make any sense.
FCC Chair Rosenworcel suggested Starlink is not a trustworthy technology. If that were true, why are other parts of the U.S. government entering into large contracts with @SpaceX for Starlink service?
The FCC should reverse its decision, because if the government tries to connect these 642,000 people using fiber, it will cost 10 times more and take years longer. SpaceX’s Starlink terminal production is ramping up so fast that they will be the largest printed circuit board manufacturer in the Americas within a few months. The biggest loser in all of this are those 642k people that could have fast internet much sooner.”
“(Left is SpaceX’s Starlink terminal production facility in Texas. Right is FCC Chair Rosenworcel’s decision letter).”
“House Oversight has subpoenaed DHS for records relating to Tim Walz’ alleged close ties to Chinese Communist Party after whistleblower informs of U.S. intelligence uncovering verified links”
Wow! I posted a comment and went to work and now there is a veritable feast of debate and I have only a few short minutes to indulge! Where to start……..
Well let’s just plunge into the isolationist deception being perpetrated by the conservatives or centrists or whatever they fancy to call themselves (to me they are simply warmongers or hawks if you prefer).
Their claim that the attack on Pearl harbor was the result of isolationism is faulty I think. I’m no expert on WW2 by any stretch, but if memory serves, I believe we cut off Japanese energy supply as well as steel. It is widely believed that was provocative. (I’m not saying we shouldn’t have done it, but we should probably have prepared for a violent reaction. ). Hindsight is 20/20 as they say and I’m not slamming the military or their obvious sacrifices. I am disputing the argument that Heritage attempts to make…basically that minding your own business is somehow a bad tthing.
How is the centrist/ moderate position of those here different than the moderates in the Senate like Mitch McConnell for example. Do you all really support our funding of the war in Ukraine. (I will promise to at least try not to call you a hawk based on the answer to this question. However, in the end I gotta tell you if it flies like a hawk, has markings like a hawk and eyes my bird feeder like hawk, I don’t care if it wants to be called a mourning dove — I’m gonna call it a hawk.
“PROJECT 2025: A current and founding trustee of the Heritage Foundation, the group behind Project 2025, has endorsed Kamala Harris for president
So didn’t Harris keep lying about this 2025 being something President Trump championed yet he denied even knowing about it? And somehow she was saying this 2025 thing was awful?! Wait…the guy that started it is endorsing Harris? Soooo is she accepting this endorsement? Inquiring minds will be following this for certain.
Debra, I’ve struggled about Ukraine, in part for the purely emotional reason that my father’s family is there. I want to see Ukraine preserved.
But no, in the end I don’t think we have a vital national interest in defending Ukraine. Certainly our own border is more important and we have to stop neglecting it.
At what point should we draw a line on Russian ambitions of empire?
I mis-typed. My father’s family is from Ukraine, not there now. I probably have distant relatives there, but as far as I know, nobody in our family here has ties to them any more.
So JAARS, where I was for six weeks last winter. is doing relief work. They are flying in a lot of donations. Went in first with a truck to have fuel there for their flights. Now they have planes and helicopters up there.
That is where our pilots are trained and they do mountain training in the area that was hit so have ties to find places to serve.
Kevin, I agree with your assessment of our situation regarding Ukraine and also our own border. It’s natural for people of good will to want to see a sovereign country and people like Ukraine preserved and all the more so when you have history there. That was more likely to happen 2 years ago than it is now unfortunately. If we had not funded and armed Ukraine for our own purposes, there would be peace there right now I believe. Still there is hope, not much I’m afraid, but some.
You asked, “At what point should we draw a line on Russian ambitions of empire?”
I would have to say I don’t know that we are morally entitled or even able to rightly judge Russian ambitions at this point. I have a lot of doubts and unanswered questions about American ambitions right now. I think it more appropriate to put our own house in order before we presume to order the house of another. If our own house is well balanced and in order, more righteous, that question might be more relevant and meaningful—assuming of course that Russia actually had ambitions of empire.
The Biden admin provoked Russia with talk of putting them in NATO, and with all the US weaponry that designation entails. Russia was never gonna stand for that any more than we stood for Russian missels in Cuba. This NATO expansion fight has been around since Bush 1. This issue isn’t new, but the Biden admin and Obama’s pals in it, reinflamed tensions.
There was even a peace plan early on that called for Russia to stay out, and us to drop the NATO ploy. The White House shot down that plan, days later, Russia invaded, and all of the bloodshed and treasure wasted since has been a result of US provocations.
Wandering Views 
I think this bipartisan report may encapsulate the centrist position better than any I’ve seen in a while. What do the centrists here think?
“The bipartisan committee charged with supporting democracy and human rights in post-Soviet states is pushing for the United States to dump the post-Cold War status quo in its relations with Russia and label Moscow as a “persistent” threat to global security.
The report from the Helsinki Commission, which was obtained by The Hill ahead of publication, argues that Washington must reframe its thinking in how it approaches Russia, as it has with China over the past few years, and allocate resources accordingly.
A priority focus of the report’s strategy is to ensure Ukraine’s victory in its defensive war against Russia, calling for “massive” military and humanitarian assistance for Kyiv and allowing Ukraine’s armed forces to strike deep into Russia with U.S. provided weapons. …
“
https://thehill.com/policy/international/4904188-us-russia-relations-helsinki-report/
Debra
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Re:
~ “Social media became a pox on your house because the media was a pox on everyone else’s.
Own it. Your industry is responsible for the rise of X.” ~
Or the people who disagree with the mainstream media could have chosen to pursue good, in-depth reporting rather than posting that hair-on-fire crap.
“He hit me first!” doesn’t work with most parents. If the mainstream media is so bad, then those others should have “hit back” with good journalism, not the quotes-and-videos-taken-out-of-context stuff that seems to permeate X.
BTW, DJ does not have to “own it.” She and other good reporters are doing the best they can in an increasingly hostile environment.
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Debra – Regarding what you commented last night about centrists being war-mongers. There is a big difference between acknowledging that sometimes military action may be necessary and being a war-monger.
As for what centrists believe, I don’t think there is a one-size-fits-all stance among them. My guess would be that they fall into the stance of military action sometimes being necessary rather than seeing war as the answer to any situation.
(Not sure if I am a “centrist”. Are “moderates” the same thing? I have tended to call myself a moderate, or a conservative-leaning moderate. )
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thanks kizzie, love that we still do have voices of reason. And yeah, I’d say ‘moderate’ and centrist’ are pretty much the same.
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“War mongers” ? Ha. Really?
Look, having a strong defense is a deterrent to war. No one here wants war. War is horrible. Sometimes it is necessary. You’re living in a dream world if you can’t see that and understand the distinction.
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How can we defend ourselves if all our resources and national debt are spent in Ukraine to perpetuate war? Who has a reasonable answer to that?
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We have an army size number of unknowns who have come across our borders for many years but mostly in the last three and a half. Will Ukraine help us to defend ourselves when we have a need?
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Face it Kizzie and Dj,
You’re now the minority in the R party, and you sound more like Democrats every day. This “centrist” or “moderate”, which is just another word for leans liberal, position in today’s climate is a losing position. Sadly, your inability to see this and accept it, will lead to Democrats winning in all likelihood. You know this, but you don’t seem to care, yet wonder why you take flack for sitting on the fence.
Kizzie,
Do you deny the media has put themselves in the position they’re in?
While Dj may be a fine local reporter, that does nothing for the horrible shape the media as a whole is in right now. They chose a side, they’re clearly biased, lie repeatedly, push dem talking points as fact, and do little more than propagandize and gaslight the nation. Perhaps if the media policed their own, things could be different. Yet you rarely if ever hear of local folks calling out the bias and trash the national media puts out. These are facts. You may not like them, but you can do little to refute them.
This idea that somehow there’s this squishy middle that the majority occupy is laughable. You have very little in common with Dems, they mock and ridicule your faith and brethren, yet you think folks should join such people as if there’s much common ground to be had. Dems bank on you NTers, and you all seem intent on delivering for them once again.
Is there middle ground on abortion? No.
On illegals invading? No.
On foreign policy? No.
On economic issues? No.
Spending? No.
The Gay/Trans agenda? No.
The mutilation of teenage genitals? No.
It’s only in the minds of the kumbaya crowd that this notion even exists.
I could go on, but why bother, lest I be accused of being mean.
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Yeah, please don’t ‘go on.’
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Debra, no one here is a “war monger” or supports war “mongering.” That is just unfair (as is taking the term “class” and making it something it’s not, but that’s a minor and rather silly point).
Being wise and knowing that we do not live in a “friendly” world but in a fallen (and often dangerous) world means realizing that war sometimes is necessary. It’s really common sense. No one wants war.
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Elon is right, and the fence sitters hate that, because they know it too.
I think deep down folks like you two have already surrendered as a result of living in occupied terroritory. It’s pushed you left and you don’t even realize it.
You think there’s common ground on this? While you dither and hand wring over the Bad Orange Man, Dems scheme and build their desired one party rule future. Trump would stop this, but you don’t care, cuz you don’t like him.
https://x.com/elonmusk/status/1840409051357696324?t=ZYjtSjhR9qn6TvEHjfIcCQ&s=19
“Very few Americans realize that, if Trump is NOT elected, this will be the last election. Far from being a threat to democracy, he is the only way to save it!
Let me explain: if even 1 in 20 illegals become citizens per year, something that the Democrats are expediting as fast as humanly possible, that would be about 2 million new legal voters in 4 years.
The voting margin in the swing states is often less than 20 thousand votes. That means if the “Democratic” Party succeeds, there will be no more swing states!!
Moreover, the Biden/Harris administration has been flying “asylum seekers”, who are fast-tracked to citizenship, directly into swing states like Pennsylvania, Ohio, Wisconsin and Arizona. It is a surefire way to win every election.
America then becomes a one-party state and Democracy is over. The only “elections” will be the Democratic Party primaries. This already happened in California many years ago, following the 1986 amnesty.
The only thing holding California back from extreme socialism and suffocating government policies is that people can leave California and still remain in America. Once the whole country is controlled by one party, there will be no escape.
Everywhere in America will be like the nightmare that is downtown San Francisco.”
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You can be snide all you want Dj, it doesn’t bother me. I’m a big boy. I have tough skin, and won’t complain like some do when I do it. Fire away.
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Really?
https://x.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1840759687232319851?t=2Xxc99-NfXlp3RvHGKA3HQ&s=19
“CNBC: What are you hearing will happen if dockworkers strike and it goes longer than a week?
Harris-Biden Commerce Sec. Gina Raimondo: “I have not been very focused on that.”
What is she focused on? That is her job.”
—-
https://x.com/TrumpWarRoom/status/1840743988166332639?t=BvXor4173qMK6HNHLxzCYg&s=19
“@JoeSquawk torches Harris surrogate Gina Raimondo:
You forgot the Trump tariffs were continued by Harris-Biden, there was no recession, real wages were up, the stock market did well, record low unemployment pre-pandemic — it’s weird to act like he’s a wildcard.”
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“Eight men, all migrants, have been arrested for allegedly looting and burglarizing flood-ravaged victims in eastern Tennessee.”
https://x.com/MrAndyNgo/status/1840641844176138307?t=Ll71pOPyJB6aO1BJIcp_Og&s=19
Migrants is just a nice way to say illegals.
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“Breaking News: Helene in Western, NC
From my friends in Asheville:
-The hospital can no longer sterilize equipment.
-There are so many bodies in cars you can NOT count. Bodies are laying everywhere.
-There is NO AID except rescues
-100 times more dire than Katrina
-Rescue hasn’t even started in most areas
-Literally Gov Roy Cooper is doing nothing but sent 500 reservists
-Zero federal help there
-Last night CNN cut off Asheville spokesman when she started to criticize the response from Roy Cooper and Biden
-Death Toll from Katrina about 1,600. This will be WAY past that. There are thousands missing.”
https://x.com/GardensR4Health/status/1840729893727850738?t=INdaVKmsYHlitovr0iqfOw&s=19
And where is Joe and Kamala?
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Sorry folks, this is what you get for voting red. He says feds are on the ground, yet it’s not nearly enough.
https://x.com/nicksortor/status/1840584521051168991?t=YebmM3XOtDAumUM6sXzTSA&s=19
“Biden just said there will be NO ADDITIONAL RESOURCES given to the areas pummeled by Hurricane Helene”
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And the squishy middle will not say a word….
https://x.com/amuse/status/1840664906816770335?t=xqzpDKkJcLGZja2JkMRKmw&s=19
“POLITICAL VIOLENCE: Nevada Democrats have hung a 43 foot tall, 6000 pound naked President Trump in effigy near Las Vegas on Interstate 15. The display cost $550K+ It is designed to incite violence against and on behalf of the former president. “
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Once again, the media sucks.
https://x.com/EYakoby/status/1840444929337606425?t=a3AnlWd1W3rRhCzqqgCB5A&s=19
“Hezbollah’s Founding Charter: “We want the elimination of Israel.”
Hassan Nasrallah: “We will murder every Jew.”
The NYT: “Hezbollah just wanted equality.”
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America last, again.
https://x.com/bennyjohnson/status/1840541184122339416?t=N_AByLNORRUL5bDugJmKAg&s=19
“Nightmarish, deadly disaster zones across 5 states. Many millions without power. Thousands missing or presumed dead. Kamala completely paralyzed. Media silent because chaos is bad optics for the regime. They spent hundreds of billions in Ukraine – won’t lift a finger for America.”
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I’m good, AJ.
Hey, I’m not even clutching my pearls! (Where are those pearls, anyway?) These are tired and unfair – not particularly even serious anymore – attacks via our new-world social media and group-think responses to serious issues we can’t seem to discuss here anymore.
It is what it is, as they used to say.
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And the media will of course follow her orders, like dutiful little lap dogs. The latest lies may even get some of them Pulitzers, just like last time!
https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1840546311134978370?t=fvaxZP7IvpQ76rHjiMPwHQ&s=19
“Hillary Clinton says “something will happen” in October, compares herself to the Greek mythological figure Cassandra & launches another Russian conspiracy theory.
Clinton called on the media to report only negative things about Trump to change Americans’ minds.
“People need to be woken up and given the facts about what he has done is saying and would do.”
“I anticipate that something will happen in October, as it always does. You know, the Russians, as I said earlier, are very active in this election.”
“We know the Iranians are active as well. Chinese uses TikTok, or they certainly did against Biden and for Trump.”
“But I anticipate there will be a full court press in October. The digital airwaves will be filled.”
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This is what Democrats call a centrist in the occupied territories of California.
https://x.com/EndWokeness/status/1840610806200746257?t=RF0MAylSrgysUfti3PU9hQ&s=19
“This is California Senator Scott Weiner, a close friend and ally of Kamala Harris. These are some of the bills he’s behind:
AB 957: Penalizes parents who don’t affirm a chiId’s trans identity
SB 107: Removes an out of state chiId from their parents if they travel to California for obtaining gender transition
SB 145: Reduced penalty for offenders who sodomize chiIdren as young as 14
SB 866: Allows kids to consent to medical decisions without parents
SB 239: Reduces penalty for deliberately spreading AIDS
SB 132: Requires prisons to put males in female prisons if they claim to feel like a woman”
——
Any common ground in there for you moderates?
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Cash for everyone! But America last.
https://x.com/GuntherEagleman/status/1840722397705502945?t=uMFj4au8TNHa9-ADgETWKg&s=19
“Biden approves $567 million is aid for North Carolina, yesterday…
Just kidding, that is aid for Taiwan. 👇”
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Surely there’s some common ground to be had here, right?
https://x.com/libsoftiktok/status/1840595828869623817?t=WWoAb8PJFhMdM2fkziKYxQ&s=19
“Meet Betsy Packard, an instructor at @UKarts_sciences. She appears to celebrate Hurricane Helene destroying cities because some of those towns are Republican.
Does @UKarts_sciences also believe this? Do they condone these messages?”
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But that Trump is so crass!
https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1840501173457183154?t=sAGxrjFttp4tkJvWERcpew&s=19
“Tim Walz gets heckled by students at the Michigan game and then appears to flip off the students. Really showing his ex-teacher, vice presidential maturity getting rattled by some college kids. Weak!”
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Has it ever been this evident how much we need King Jesus?
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This Biden/Harris administration is a joke. But Joe said he sent all they have.
But they need not worry, the media will run cover for this @#$% show.
https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1840574035962351807?t=B_2ofNllnCaCCa_DNIK-qQ&s=19
“Privately owned helicopters are delivering supplies to stranded victims as the government is “nowhere to be found” after Hurricane Helene demolished the Southeast.
Locals are volunteering their time and money to help Americans in need.
“Today, myself and my family cooked three pans of hot food to send across the [Nolichucky] river to those stranded due to the failure of all but one bridge in our region,” said one TikTok user.
The user, ‘cayotecowgirl,’ is located in Greeneville, Tennessee.
“Three pans of food to help feed what we would find out was over 1500 evacuees. Upon reaching the relief hub that had been set up, we were informed that aside from the state troopers, highway department, and first responders on the scene, absolutely no government help has been offered.”
“The helicopters delivering supplies across the river are privately owned and funded, pilots volunteering their own time, machines, and fuel.”
“The cases of water, baby formula, diapers, and food are paid for by those that have banded together to form a relief effort.”
“Our governors, politicians, town officials are NOWHERE to be found. Where is the coverage?? Where is the aid?? I am incredibly proud of the community I call home…”
Video: cayotecowgirl on TT.
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This kind of disastrous foreign policy needs to die a slow, painful death. This is why establishment types love it so, it benefits their donors, and their stock portfolios.
https://x.com/Holden_Culotta/status/1840172492251640042?t=O3DI1i2xI3zwZwSX4O4drw&s=19
“RFK Jr: “Why are we in all these wars? … Here’s the reason why.”
“When a new nation enters NATO, the contract requires it to conform its weapons purchases to NATO specifications, which means billions and billions of dollars for Lockheed, Northrop Grumman, Boeing, General Dynamics and the other military contractors.
Who owns all of those? One company: BlackRock. These are the people who are dictating what the Democratic Party does.””
—–
And the establishment shills on the right play along gleefully….
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Leaders lead, cowards hide.
https://x.com/seanmdav/status/1840437141412651221?t=GT2XY2mobXqF0aAF34KAYA&s=19
“Two states are underwater, Americans are stranded without food or supplies, and Joe Biden and Kamala Harris are completely AWOL.”
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AJ, I do hope you take some time to search out and read some of the newer online political sites that aim to take seriously and treat “both” sides of many of these issues. (Assuming you actually do miss real journalism.) You won’t see that generally on social media, especially not on “X.”
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You can always get one-sided outrage on “X” but … Is that really a good basis for serious consideration of the issues that face us?
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Everything they do is a staged photo op.
https://x.com/MZHemingway/status/1840786568522457194?t=-6EO15792qLyJvnUmw93xg&s=19
“This is the most VEEP-like photo ever — pretending to be on a phone call but forgetting to plug in the antiquated earphones while pretending to write on a blank piece of paper instead of actually doing anything.”
—-
https://x.com/GrageDustin/status/1840782135289905300?t=4idln5OvVW3NnRE0YnztWg&s=19
“Tim Walz and his wife cheering while no one is on the field is such a heartwarming story….”
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“Breaking News: All of the shelters in Asheville are at capacity.
Fox News Reporters on the ground in Asheville say that FEMA isn’t on the ground helping the shelters and several have run out of water.
The Fox Reporter is trying to find answers on why FEMA isn’t there to assist.”
https://x.com/wendyp4545/status/1840766550758084803?t=uBCTsd29whZw3JRUQdwthA&s=19
Where’s Joe and Kamala?
Staging photos.
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Just sayin’ since you seem to hate one-sided journalism, you might want to leave “X” (which isn’t journalism, but it is one-sided) from time to time to search out some more ideas and try to understand the arguments. I mean, if you truly want to at least visit some better sources. They do exist! 🙂
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Just tell them ya’ll are illegals, they’ll set you right up with food, housing, and cash.
https://x.com/nicksortor/status/1840769966024368348?t=Z6vk-yR3qGOQMItifjqNWA&s=19
“ALERT: Shelters in West North Carolina are OVER CAPACITY and DO NOT HAVE ENOUGH FOOD
And FEMA is NOWHERE TO BE FOUND.
I’m beyond infuriated.
@ChrisHallWx and I were luckily able to fill the gap with hot pizzas and Gatorade, as one shelter was 30 MEALS SHORT
What the hell is going on??! WHERE ARE BIDEN AND HARRIS?”
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Priorities, and you ain’t one of them.
https://x.com/mattmercer/status/1840545964416761958?t=RQGMe2A4yPguKM9Kyp41MA&s=19
“Democrats holding a high-dollar fundraiser in NC as every hour we learn more about destruction of entire towns in the mountains?”
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Well it’s not like most of the media was gonna cover it anyway. Too damaging to the regime that controls them.
https://x.com/jimgeraghty/status/1840757431757832675?t=xx7W1YG_9_01Zm3UR_YouQ&s=19
“In one of the most jaw-dropping Friday-afternoon news dumps of all time, U.S. Immigration and Customs Enforcement revealed that the agency’s docket included more than 662,000 illegal immigrants who either had a criminal conviction or were awaiting a verdict in a criminal case, including more than 13,000 convicted murderers, more than 15,000 convicted of sexual assault, more than 2,500 convicted of kidnapping, and more than 62,000 convicted of assault.”
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Well, AJ, I am sure that folks on the left think that “centrist” or “moderate” mean leaning right. In fact, I have been accused and dismissed by folks on both sides for “obviously” being on the other side. There is too much of an attitude of “If you don’t completely agree with my side then you must be on the other side” on both far sides of the spectrum.
Don’t be too sure that DJ and I are in the minority among general Republicans. As that article yesterday mentioned, the majority of folks on each side are not on the far edges, but more on an actual spectrum of stances.
Even if we do turn out to be in a losing position, our mutual faith tells us that the winning position is not necessarily the right one. Throughout history, “the majority” has often been wrong, but that was not realized until later. And remember, the results of the election are ultimately in God’s hands, so if Harris wins, take it up with Him.
“You know this, but you don’t seem to care, yet wonder why you take flack for sitting on the fence.”
You keep telling DJ and me that we don’t care, or similar accusations, because we dare to have a different view. I can assure you that we do care – very much – we just see things differently. I have prayed, and are praying, about all of this, and care very deeply. But I will not be bullied or shamed into following the “approved blog view”. (And apparently, neither will DJ.)
That there are problems with the mainstream media does not mean that other media can be just as bad (or worse) but in their own way. Continuing my comparison to kids fighting, parents used to say (and I’m sure many still do), “I don’t care what Jimmy did. You’re supposed to know better than that.”
For all those questions you asked to which you answered “No”, in reality, there are those on the left who do in fact disagree to one degree or another with those things.
And for the record, we are not dithering and handwringing.
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Truth.
https://x.com/charliekirk11/status/1840483008371212436?t=iuobhef3K2dHvb_LbcHQ1Q&s=19
“Anyone who talks about a “pathway to citizenship” isn’t serious about fixing the border.
Anyone who says we should have passed the “bipartisan border bill” isn’t serious about fixing the border.
Anyone who lets in 10,000,000+ illegal aliens in 3.5 years and claimed the border was closed is not serious about fixing the border.
Anyone who loses 320,000 migrant kids in 3.5 years isn’t serious about fixing the border.
Anyone who chants with activists “down down with deportations” isn’t serious about fixing the border.
Anyone that talks about abolishing ICE isn’t serious about fixing the border.
Anyone who defends sanctuary city policies isn’t serious about fixing the border.
Anyone who says there’s no such thing as criminal illegals isn’t serious about fixing the border.
Anyone who is against HR 2, the SAVE Act, and mass deportations isn’t serious about fixing the border.
That anyone is Kamala Harris.
She’s trying to replace you with compliant foreigner voters who will turn America into a one-party ruled country.
She must be stopped to save America.”
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What Kizzie said.
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Staying on “X” is living in a bunker, it’s a silo of echos you only want to hear; hands over your ears when any other view is presented.
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“Kamala used every available government resource to airlift and evacuate 500 thousand Haitian illegals to the United States. But she couldn’t lift a finger to rescue drowning Americans in Asheville”
Meanwhile she’s dining comfortably at a fundraiser.”
https://x.com/FFT1776/status/1840574936919728263?t=cbe9odQ7w30l4PBOJb9xJw&s=19
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“Hemingway: U.S. Government Should Prioritize Its Own Hurricane Victims Over Illegal Aliens And Overseas Wars”
https://x.com/FDRLST/status/1840795240766325009?t=8PhSTcRPinxdeiE4wtehqg&s=19
What a concept!
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Ross Douthat:
~ A few weeks ago, just after Robert Kennedy Jr.’s endorsement of Donald Trump, Matt Yglesias wrote an essay on what he called “the crank realignment” — the recent migration of a lot of conspiratorial, tinfoil-hatted and outsider-knowledge-oriented elements in American politics toward the populist right, and the consolidation of most educated professionals and academics within the Democratic coalition.
This trend is one of the most important developments of the Trump era, and I appreciated Yglesias’s attempt to distill the problems that it creates for both coalitions. For the right, there’s a basic competence and human capital problem, because a paranoid populism repels a lot of intelligent people whom you would need to actually create or sustain a conservative establishment, which in turn makes it hard, as Yglesias writes, “to actually marshal knowledge and govern the country.” (The party that nominates someone like Mark Robinson for governor of North Carolina is not exactly advertising its seriousness or competence.) For the left, there’s a problem that “turning fields like journalism, social science and public health into partisan monocultures makes it harder for them to perform their epistemic functions,” because without any conservative leaven they fall prey much too easily to groupthink and confirmation bias. … ~
He continues: ~ I want to go a bit further into both sides’ struggles. First, on the right, the problem isn’t just that talented people are marginalized under these conditions, it’s that even when talented people do rise to positions of influence and power, they’re often still caught up in the vortex of conspiratorial impulses, Manichaelan thinking and dubious ideas.
… Thus a character like Elon Musk, for instance, is one of the most dynamic and creative figures in the world, no matter what his haters say, but you wouldn’t know it from a lot of his right-leaning social media engagement. And Vance himself, who is as capable at arguing about public policy as any Republican candidate in my lifetime, has staff members who were out trying to validate rumors about cat-eating migrants because those are the stories that Trump and the right-wing have in mind to tell … ~
* dj
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Staying on X is living in a bunker?
This from the echo chamber media….
There are literally a gazillion media options on X, including many liberal ones. Your feed is determined by who you follow. It is what you make it. If your feed isn’t to your liking, try other sources.
Also, it’s ironic that many of your preferred sources fled X because there were just too many Trump people. They couldn’t tolerate opposition voices, so they fled to the safety of liberal echo chambers, where their lies and BS wouldn’t be called out. Trumpers aren’t their targeted audience anyway, right? They weren’t looking to change minds anyway, just suck in income from the true believers who actually buy their rubbish.
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I comment less often, but you might as well count me in with DJ and Kizzie. I agree with them a lot of the time. But I have no pearls.
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That was me.
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“How would the media have reacted if President Trump had been sitting on the beach while towns all over America were being wiped out by a hurricane?”
https://x.com/greg_price11/status/1840789755308777643?t=MFHj_ia6d-x0OGuau7DowQ&s=19
You know the answer. But still people defend biased and useless media.
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(Douthat continued):
~ Second, the power of crankishness on the right is a problem even when the cranks are correct. Overall, I tend to have more sympathy for fringe ideas than some mainstream newspaper columnists. I think that some conspiracy theories are connected to overlooked realities. I’m confident that the paranormal and supernatural are more important aspects of reality than most secular observers recognize. My experience with chronic illness persuaded me that some forms of strange outsider knowledge in medicine have a lot to offer.
But if you have undiscovered or underreported truths out there, moving them from the fringe to the center is a challenging undertaking. Even when they’re world-historically important, as with the world’s mounting birthrate crisis, the stink of weirdness can be awfully hard to shake. And it becomes that much more challenging when they’re part of a larger sea of ideologically motivated credulity, such that the same guy who is saying Weird Thing X (which might well turn out to be true) is also saying Weird Things P and Q and R (which are false or just insane).
Unfortunately, it’s a characteristic human tendency to discover that the official narrative is wrong about some important thing and then leap to the conclusion that it must be wrong about absolutely everything. I found this to be true time and again in my journeys on the medical fringe, where I would find a practitioner or author with some key insight or discovery who had become far too credulous about any and all anti-establishment ideas. And now it’s true in right-wing politics, as well, which makes it hard to take the fringe-but-possibly-true ideas that show up on Joe Rogan’s show or in a Tucker Carlson interview and separate them from the ideas that are fringe-and-simply-false.
Now let’s talk about liberalism’s problems in this landscape. … ~
Yglesias is a little too quick to say that the crank realignment has made liberal politics “less friendly to nut jobs,” full stop. Rather, it’s made liberal politics less friendly to certain fringe ideas that used to have more of a home inside the liberal tent — vaccine skepticism, Michael Moore-style foreign policy analysis, etc. — but arguably more vulnerable to the forms of ideological fanaticism and flimflam that remain.
That is, as crankishness has become more right-coded, it’s become easier for liberals to assume that if some idea isn’t right-coded it can’t be crankish or fanatical or kooky. The rise of various antiracist guru figures during the Great Awokening, the elevation of hucksters like Robin DiAngelo and Tema Okun (about whom Yglesias has written perceptively) to undeserved prominence in progressive thought and institutions, was enabled by some of these assumptions — that the right is inherently extreme and the left is inherently reality-based and serious, so if left-leaning institutions are embracing weird-seeming ideas about “white supremacy culture,” well, they must have some sort of respectable intellectual foundation. (They don’t.) …
… Good causes no less than bad ones can be taken up by disturbed individuals. But it is a warning to a liberalism that imagines that having crankish enemies supplies some kind of immunity to extremism or folly. There is no such guarantee: You can have Kennedy as your political adversary and still discover, too late, that extremism in the defense of centrism can also be a vice. ~
https://messaging-custom-newsletters.nytimes.com/dynamic/render?campaign_id=280&emc=edit_rd_20240920&first_send=0&instance_id=134858&isViewInBrowser=true&nl=ross-douthat®i_id=94207220&segment_id=178399&te=1&uri=nyt://newsletter/b6988242-d8eb-5baa-a2b4-5bf760b40a78&user_id=448c637b2a33ad261acc501b226b1a2f
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Kevin, lol . (Actually I have no pearls either, but am especially glad to hear that you don’t.)
AJ, Douthat is a good writer and good thinker. There are others out there. Find them.
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“She couldn’t lift a finger to rescue drowning Americans in Asheville.” Really? What exactly did you expect her, or the Federal government, to do? Wave a magic wand?
As I recall George W Bush was widely criticized for what appeared to be a slow unfeeling response to Hurricane Katrina.
Trucks can’t get in because roads are washed out. FEMA is working with the Army Core of Engineers to begin rebuilding roads and bridges. Airlifts are being set up. This all takes time. It’s been less than three days since the storm ended.
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I guess I am still trying to understand how the Centists or Modrrates here on the blog feel about the actual issues and not how they feel about AJ’s posts. I want to understand why they feel a certain different way than what is called here, “the majority.” We are such a small sample that I think it is not representative of the US population.
I always see quotes from others who are deemed more wise, more informed, more in tune with God, etc., but I don’t typically see much about the issues and why people see it as they do. Do we have globalists here? I am getting the impression that we do. Is that because you are trying to see the world as you think God sees it?
Speaking of Asheville, isn’t that where World Magazine offices are located?
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Cheryl mentioned World Magazine late last night on yesterday’s News thread.
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“WORLD’s headquarters is located in the Biltmore Village area and suffered major damage. Andrew Belz, major gifts officer for WORLD, reported that both buildings had suffered several feet of flooding and windows had burst in at least one building.”
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Thanks for reposting that, Kevin, and adding some additional updates. I’d seen Cheryl’s post late last night and I’m afraid it got lost in the ongoing political back-and-forth.
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Thanks, Kevin, and Cheryl.
One of the Belz men is a pastor at a local PCA church. Wes knew him at Covenant. He saw him at the coffee shop at our nearby Toco Hills shopping plaza. I think the shop is named something like Spiller’s Corner 🙂
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Janice, don’t think anyone here would claim the term “globalist.” We are interconnected with other nations, always have been (and will be even if we prefer isolationism). But I think the term “globalist” (politically) means something quite different, I’ve not researched it.
So short answer, no. 🙂
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(But good question, it’s a term that we do hear more often now and may mean different things to different people.)
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If Globalism means ceding national sovereignty to some kind of global authority (UN or other), that’s a hard no for me.
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Kevin, agree with that.
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Isolationism – no; but rather, non-interventionism.
USA first, but not USA only. Our foreign policy should be what best advances the USA’s interests. Allies (such as NATO members) need to pay their fair share. Other nations are more likely to start wars when they don’t bear the full costs of those wars (i.e. they don’t bear the full burden of the risks that they take).
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Under this administration it is perfectly clear the USA is not first on the list. It is their agenda no matter the cost to our citizenry. I don’t like war..who does? But I feel it is imperative to have a military strong and ready. We don’t….
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Leaders lead, cowards hide on the beach and in their bunkers.
https://x.com/EndWokeness/status/1840817525078028552?t=MuMpPIuQ19zpWV5WbijBfg&s=19
“Trump flew directly to Valdosta to deliver critical supplies to the victims of Helene.
Biden was at the beach all weekend.
Kamala staged a phone call photo.”
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The source (The Heritage Foundation) is more classic conservatism that will be rejected by some here, I realize, but I did find this piece on Isolationist vs. Noninterventionist. The author is probably correct in that a debate is needed to more clearly understand the terms.
https://www.heritage.org/political-process/report/neither-isolationist-nor-noninterventionist-the-right-way-think-about
Neither Isolationist nor Noninterventionist: The Right Way to Think About Foreign Policy
There is a lot of confusion about America’s proper role in the world at the moment. The terms “isolationism” and “noninterventionism” are often used without clear meaning. These two concepts do have specific definitions that should be properly understood, but we must also be aware of how these terms are being used. The stakes are high, and America cannot afford another deadly encounter with isolationism.
A debate is needed. How else can America’s principles be prudently applied to foreign policy? Disagreement over the merits of a particular war is not, in itself, indicative of rising isolationism in Republican ranks. Indeed, most people shun isolationism. But for the war-weary, it may sound tempting to embrace strict noninterventionism, even if they don’t wish for America to isolate itself from the world. The problem is that many arguments now masquerading as “noninterventionist” are actually isolationist and, as such, at odds with America’s principles and foreign policy traditions. …
… A noninterventionist policy is a particular policy of political or military noninvolvement in foreign relations or in other countries’ internal affairs. The United States has sometimes followed a short-term policy of nonintervention, more accurately termed “neutrality.” This began with George Washington’s Proclamation of Neutrality in 1793, which remained in force until naval hostilities broke out between the United States and Revolutionary France a few years later.
Modern advocates of so-called noninterventionism, however, often go far beyond a specific policy of nonintervention or neutrality and instead advocate an isolationist doctrine of strict noninterventionism, which prescribes that America should remain militarily uninvolved abroad except when there is a clear and imminent threat to U.S. territory. This understanding of noninterventionism is a key element of an isolationist grand strategy and stands at odds with the guiding principles of U.S. foreign policy going back to the early years of the Republic. …
… Whereas past disputes over war-making had involved individual situations, opponents of wars in the 20th century have increasingly begun to invoke a sweeping doctrine of noninterventionism. Several authors today advocate this truly isolationist doctrine, and many of these “noninterventionists” claim to represent the Founders’ foreign policy. According to Congressman Ron Paul (R–TX), for example, the United States should “return to the traditional U.S. foreign policy of…non-interventionism.”
Many Americans have fallen for this isolationist doctrine before. We must not do it again, even though the waters have been thoroughly muddied by partisan politics and frequent misuse of the terms “isolationism” and “noninterventionism.” …
… Americans did fall for an isolationist doctrine under the mantle of noninterventionism in the late 1930s and early 1940s; its disastrous effects culminated in the uncontested rise of Hitler’s Germany and the attack on Pearl Harbor. …
More at the link.
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Elon is a class act. Despite the federal lawsuit against him, and the feds slow rolling approval for his rockets, he can be counted on to do the right thing.
He’s bringing the astronauts home, something our clueless govt can no longer accomplish, and now he’s aiding relief efforts.
https://x.com/WallStreetSilv/status/1840843282483720586?t=qtJHMLGVFFuNk8eim99gfQ&s=19
“FEMA is now using Elon’s Starlink for emergency communications in the flood hit disaster areas.
The FCC has $42 billion to connect rural Americans to the internet.
Joe Biden cancelled Starlink from being able to participate in the funding.”
—–
That 42 billion is to launder money to his global warming scammer/donors, which launder it back thru campaign donation.
Help Americans with it?
Pffffttttt.. .. As if.
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The Heritage Foundation has thankfully lost most of its influence. That’s a good thing, since they’re all such principled conservatives…..
Not surprising it’s still big in Never Trump circles.
https://x.com/LFATVUS/status/1840751586668089842?t=kp2PPkagHI15uhXsCqlUxg&s=19
“Original Heritage Foundation Trustee just endorsed Kamala Harris and ripped Trump in new op-ed to Philadelphia Inquirer!”
—–
https://x.com/amuse/status/1840454723717202384?t=USxayjwfVHPoXxyD_L-42Q&s=19
“PROJECT 2025: A current and founding trustee of the Heritage Foundation, the group behind Project 2025, has endorsed Kamala Harris for president.
Former Congressman Mickey Edwards threw his support behind Harris, arguing she aligns better with many of the policies outlined in Project 2025, particularly on foreign policy.
Edwards emphasized the danger of authoritarian regimes like China, Russia, and North Korea, suggesting they could manipulate a Trump administration through flattery, making Harris a stronger candidate in safeguarding American interests.”
—–
The people endlessly pushing war will side with whoever seems most likely to give them what they want. They’re conniving opportunists who sway with the wind. That’s the problem with ’em. They can only sell it if people buy it. More and more aren’t, thankfully. Trump threatens their status quo, and relevance. I’d fear him too, we’re I them.
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Leaders, lead.
https://x.com/SloanRachmuth/status/1840716234314125745?t=YIkSaXyX3H5d2AuP4cZdxw&s=19
“A tale of two candidates for NC Governor during NC’s worst modern disaster.
Democrat Josh Stein had a ball hosting an exclusive fundraiser.
Republican Mark Robinson has been on the ground all weekend with FEMA and Sheriffs overseeing recovery efforts in WNC. “
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More on Biden and Starlink.
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2024/jun/21/bidens-stalled-rural-internet-program-ignites-deba/
Starlink satellites are already proving themselves in a lot of areas. I have a coworker in rural Maryland who works from home using Starlink. Musk is getting it done, federal subsidies or not. How shortsighted not to partner with him. How ironic for FEMA to need Starlink now.
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Something to consider as he helps anyway.
https://x.com/SawyerMerritt/status/1840783831609262433?t=UHkyqgvqy0MpQHN40VrA7Q&s=19
“Last year, the FCC upheld its 2022 decision to deny SpaceX’s @Starlink an $885 million subsidy to bring broadband to 642,000 Americans living in rural areas. FCC Chair Jessica Rosenworcel didn’t think Starlink could deliver the promised service.
Today, Starlink is connecting over 7,700 new customers per day, FEMA is sending Starlink terminals to help victims in North Carolina due to Hurricane Helene, and the world’s largest airlines are signing contracts to outfit their entire fleets with it. It has proven to be a reliable and fast service for millions of users.
The FCC had program requirements that Starlink didn’t have to meet until 2025, yet the FCC Chair was unfairly making a prediction about whether Starlink would meet them or not years before the deadline. Starlink needed to show that it was more likely than not that it could provide high-speed Internet service (low-latency, 100/20 Mbps service) to at least 40% of the 642,000 rural premises by Dec 31, 2025. Starlink did that.
So why revoke that $885M award? It doesn’t make any sense.
FCC Chair Rosenworcel suggested Starlink is not a trustworthy technology. If that were true, why are other parts of the U.S. government entering into large contracts with @SpaceX for Starlink service?
The FCC should reverse its decision, because if the government tries to connect these 642,000 people using fiber, it will cost 10 times more and take years longer. SpaceX’s Starlink terminal production is ramping up so fast that they will be the largest printed circuit board manufacturer in the Americas within a few months. The biggest loser in all of this are those 642k people that could have fast internet much sooner.”
“(Left is SpaceX’s Starlink terminal production facility in Texas. Right is FCC Chair Rosenworcel’s decision letter).”
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AJ @5:12 — that’s it? An ad hominem attack rather than debating the merits of the point?
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“President Trump just announced he’s partnering with @elonmusk to provide Starlinks to communities across the southeast hit by the Hurricane”
https://x.com/nicksortor/status/1840825911761043826?t=HE-MyN7_S6O6iFn6R8MJvw&s=19
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AJ, I have a comment on Starlink awaiting moderation.
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Oh my…..
https://x.com/bennyjohnson/status/1840868215326716028?t=70MfsW1R7m_nAA1IETYsYw&s=19
“House Oversight has subpoenaed DHS for records relating to Tim Walz’ alleged close ties to Chinese Communist Party after whistleblower informs of U.S. intelligence uncovering verified links”
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Got it Kevin, it’s up now.
More than 2 links it sees it as possible spam.
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Wow! I posted a comment and went to work and now there is a veritable feast of debate and I have only a few short minutes to indulge! Where to start……..
Well let’s just plunge into the isolationist deception being perpetrated by the conservatives or centrists or whatever they fancy to call themselves (to me they are simply warmongers or hawks if you prefer).
Their claim that the attack on Pearl harbor was the result of isolationism is faulty I think. I’m no expert on WW2 by any stretch, but if memory serves, I believe we cut off Japanese energy supply as well as steel. It is widely believed that was provocative. (I’m not saying we shouldn’t have done it, but we should probably have prepared for a violent reaction. ). Hindsight is 20/20 as they say and I’m not slamming the military or their obvious sacrifices. I am disputing the argument that Heritage attempts to make…basically that minding your own business is somehow a bad tthing.
oops time’s up
debra
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Wow, not only did I miss my chance at 57, but 75 too!
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Debra @6:00 — It’s election season!
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And neither warmongers or hawks. 🙂
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Another short break.
How is the centrist/ moderate position of those here different than the moderates in the Senate like Mitch McConnell for example. Do you all really support our funding of the war in Ukraine. (I will promise to at least try not to call you a hawk based on the answer to this question. However, in the end I gotta tell you if it flies like a hawk, has markings like a hawk and eyes my bird feeder like hawk, I don’t care if it wants to be called a mourning dove — I’m gonna call it a hawk.
debra
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Texted a friend (in response to a political joke he’d sent):
“No good choices in ’24.”
His reply:
“No. None.”
There are more of us than some of you realize.
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“PROJECT 2025: A current and founding trustee of the Heritage Foundation, the group behind Project 2025, has endorsed Kamala Harris for president
So didn’t Harris keep lying about this 2025 being something President Trump championed yet he denied even knowing about it? And somehow she was saying this 2025 thing was awful?! Wait…the guy that started it is endorsing Harris? Soooo is she accepting this endorsement? Inquiring minds will be following this for certain.
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Debra, I’ve struggled about Ukraine, in part for the purely emotional reason that my father’s family is there. I want to see Ukraine preserved.
But no, in the end I don’t think we have a vital national interest in defending Ukraine. Certainly our own border is more important and we have to stop neglecting it.
At what point should we draw a line on Russian ambitions of empire?
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I mis-typed. My father’s family is from Ukraine, not there now. I probably have distant relatives there, but as far as I know, nobody in our family here has ties to them any more.
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So JAARS, where I was for six weeks last winter. is doing relief work. They are flying in a lot of donations. Went in first with a truck to have fuel there for their flights. Now they have planes and helicopters up there.
That is where our pilots are trained and they do mountain training in the area that was hit so have ties to find places to serve.
Jo
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Kevin, I agree with your assessment of our situation regarding Ukraine and also our own border. It’s natural for people of good will to want to see a sovereign country and people like Ukraine preserved and all the more so when you have history there. That was more likely to happen 2 years ago than it is now unfortunately. If we had not funded and armed Ukraine for our own purposes, there would be peace there right now I believe. Still there is hope, not much I’m afraid, but some.
You asked, “At what point should we draw a line on Russian ambitions of empire?”
I would have to say I don’t know that we are morally entitled or even able to rightly judge Russian ambitions at this point. I have a lot of doubts and unanswered questions about American ambitions right now. I think it more appropriate to put our own house in order before we presume to order the house of another. If our own house is well balanced and in order, more righteous, that question might be more relevant and meaningful—assuming of course that Russia actually had ambitions of empire.
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The Biden admin provoked Russia with talk of putting them in NATO, and with all the US weaponry that designation entails. Russia was never gonna stand for that any more than we stood for Russian missels in Cuba. This NATO expansion fight has been around since Bush 1. This issue isn’t new, but the Biden admin and Obama’s pals in it, reinflamed tensions.
There was even a peace plan early on that called for Russia to stay out, and us to drop the NATO ploy. The White House shot down that plan, days later, Russia invaded, and all of the bloodshed and treasure wasted since has been a result of US provocations.
https://www.npr.org/2022/01/29/1076193616/ukraine-russia-nato-explainer
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