There is no way we can know all the information that our politicians are getting from various sources, or all the possibilities for legislation. I think assuming bad motives and calling people liars is not something that should come easily by us. We can disagree without legislation or actions with doing that.
My comment on Ilhan was based on her lying on forms to get subsidized housing. That is somethings that can be checked out by those who should be doing so. It is sad that it is not being done or that our government agencies are also not doing so. We know others would be investigated.
Though I don’t always agree with him, I consider Rand Paul to be one of the most consistent and principled politician currently serving. His take on Johnson’s behavior:
“As I see it now, I’m not so sure there’s a difference between Mike Johnson being in charge and Democrats being in charge,” he said. “The debt, the deficit this year will be $1.5-2 trillion, and that’s Mike Johnson’s bill, he put it forward, he supported it with a minority of Republicans, with the majority of Democrats. This is not using the power of the purse, this is abdicating the power of the purse.”
He continued: “People have to be strong in their convictions. He was seen as a conservative before he came to the speakership…but now he’s completely changed and lost all his principles…If the Democrats want this level of spending, we want this level of compromise, splitting the difference. The Democrats got everything they want in the spending [bill], and all the hawks got what they want too.”
I agree with Kathleena’s first graph and thank her for posting that. Johnson has cited intelligence briefings as weighing into his understanding as well as his own sense of what is right.
There are also ‘numbers’ to consider strategically, especially in the divided period we find ourselves in now; passing what can be passed and in the form it can be passed. There will always be some trade-offs under our form of government, even in the best of times.
Personally, I’m gaining new respect for Johnson, I think he brings a calm spirit and practical-minded approach and demeanor to the national stage. We need that, though it may be too late to make a difference. Let’s see what plays out going forward.
Ok ladies, let’s give him the benefit of the doubt on Ukraine and the Israel funding.
Now what “intelligence” do you think it was that made him not keep his promises to close the southern border and stop the invasion?
He lied, it’s that simple. He tried to use it to get support for the other issues, and then did nothing once he realized he had enough Dem support to back stab the R base. You can’t get around that fact, even if you give him the benefit of the doubt on Ukraine.
I doubt Johnson wants the border open. He may have learned something that shows a greater danger to the USA than the open border, with an even tighter time line. I don ‘t know. He is bringing a new direction. I will pray for him and trust him for now.
So @3:45: Re language; in the interest of fairness — and, more importantly, Christian ethics which we all presumably have been taught and are trying to live by — it is perhaps more fair and honest to say: “I believe he’s lying” or, better, “I believe he’s not being truthful.” ?
It rightly puts the onus on the person making the charge as speaking about things we can’t (be honest) fully know.
And it rightly gives room and Christian charity to acknowledge now or later that, yes, you may be wrong.
We are all viewing this from afar. We may be wrong on any given issue or, especially our assumptions. We can’t say we *know* what someone else (whom we don’t even know personally) believes.
I believe that Johnson has acted in good faith. I accept his account because it makes the most sense to me. I may be wrong, but this is what I believe his actions convey.
And his account also is consistent with the evidence we have and who he persuasively says he is — a believer who knows has studied and understands God’s word — (while I may possibly have some theological quibbles with his understanding of some finer points) — and is attempting to live by it in what is a very difficult position.
Prayer for him is very appropriate considering the stress he is under.
They saw WAVES of illegals pouring through gaps in the wall & spoke to experts on the DEVASTATING impact of @JoeBiden’s open border pic.twitter.com/04mt2IFloX
NEW: In statement to @FoxNews, the Border Patrol union responds to the passing of the $95 billion foreign aid package:
"We are beyond disappointed that the House would give aid to secure the borders of foreign countries, but gave nothing to allow the Border Patrol to secure the…
“In statement to @FoxNews, the Border Patrol union responds to the passing of the $95 billion foreign aid package:”
We are beyond disappointed that the House would give aid to secure the borders of foreign countries, but gave nothing to allow the Border Patrol to secure the safety of the United States. There’s nothing more backwards. I wouldn’t have even expected tax payer’s dollars. They could have given us policy, and that would have been enough.”
– Brandon Judd, President, National Border Patrol Council
Reminder: Judd/BP Union supported the bipartisan border deal that was attached to this foreign funding before Republicans killed it.”
I’ve already expressed what I believe about the situation with the Speaker of the House and have nothing much to add. It was mildly disgusting to watch all the Ukrainian flags flutter as the House voted to enslave American citizens further on behalf of their pet project. I pray for Johnson the same thing I would pray for anyone else in his situation: may God have mercy on his soul, and even more so on his victims. However, in the middle of all this I have a surprising peace with regard to our national situation. I have no idea what will happen, although I do think the ship has already hit the iceberg (or at least scraped it) and we’re patiently waiting for what comes next. As Believers we know the One we ultimately trust for the resolution of all things, and that must be sufficient.
We all would like to see a border bill passed. But there aren’t currently the votes to do that.
WSJ: Mr. Johnson’s behavior is called leadership, and the GOP would be more popular and better able to govern if more of its members showed such mettle themselves—or had more respect for those who demonstrate it.
From the Institute for the Study of War. (The bold parts are that way in the article.)
“Why You Can’t Be an Iran Hawk and a Russia Dove
A Russian victory is an Iranian victory. Moscow and Tehran have formed a military bloc with the aim of defeating the United States and its allies in the Middle East, Europe, and around the world. Russian and Iranian military forces have been fighting alongside one another in Syria for nearly a decade. The Russians have given Iran advanced air defenses and access to other military technologies and techniques, in addition to a front-row seat observing their efforts to defeat American and NATO missile defenses in Ukraine.[1] The Iranians in turn have given the Russians drones and access to drone technologies, including assisting with the construction of a massive factory to turn out thousands of Iranian drones in Russia.[2] Further Russian support to Iran has been limited in part because of the setbacks Russia has suffered in Ukraine. A victorious Russia will be free to give Iran the advanced aircraft and missile technologies Tehran has long sought.[3] If Russia gains control of Ukraine’s resources, as it seeks to do, it will be able to rebuild its own military and help Iran at the same time. Those concerned with the growth of Iran’s military power, ambitions, and aggression in the Middle East must recognize the degree to which Iran’s fortunes rise and fall with Russia’s. [. . .]
Constraints on Russia’s ability to supply Iran with advanced weaponry will also begin lifting if Russia defeats Ukraine. Ukrainian forces supplied with Western weapons have wrought havoc on Russian systems, destroying thousands of tanks and armored personnel carriers as well as aircraft and air defense systems. The Russian defense industry has been racing to make good Russian losses, and its inability to do so has led in part to Russia’s desperation for Iranian (and North Korean and Chinese) military assistance. Ukraine once defeated, however, the Russian defense industry will remain mobilized first to rebuild the Russian army, but then to resume the export of advanced military systems interrupted by the war. The increasingly close relationship between Russia and Iran spurred by Iran’s stalwart support for the Russian war effort makes the prospect that Russia will ultimately follow through on promises to give Iran some of its most advanced military systems much likelier than it has ever been.
There is little reason to expect that the West can drive a wedge between Moscow and Tehran at this point. Russian rhetoric and actions have become ferociously anti-Western and have come to share many of the overtones of civilizational conflict that have long characterized Iranian ideology. The fact that Russia seeks, in principle, to build an anti-Western Christian civilization whereas Tehran desires an anti-Western Muslim one is not material as long as both agree that defeating the United States and its allies is the top priority, as they do.
The primary constraint on Russian support to Iran, therefore, is Russia’s weakness. A Russia battered by failure in Ukraine, licking its wounds, and facing a strong and independent Ukrainian state will have limited resources and energy to devote to helping Iran. A Russia triumphant over the United States and NATO in Ukraine and with the resources of Ukraine at its disposal, on the other hand, will have ample capacity to repay its friends and support them in their efforts to achieve an aim Russia shares — defeating the United States and expelling it from the Middle East.
The notion that the United States should allow Russia to win in Ukraine in order to resist Iran in the Middle East is thus indefensible. Americans must internalize the unpleasant reality that the Russo-Iranian military bloc is a real and vibrant thing, that Moscow will support Tehran against us and our allies as best it can, and that Russia’s victory is Iran’s victory. Russia’s loss, contrariwise, is Iran’s loss. Those wishing to contain Iran therefore must also support helping Ukraine against Russia.”
Mike Johnson had very little choice but to bring a vote to the Ukraine legislation. He’s in a minority situation and will not get anything done without cooperation from different groups. Traditional Republicans recognise the stakes in Ukraine along with traditional Democrats. And thus there’s enough pressure to bring it to a vote.
A bill to deal with the border is already written and the only thing that is preventing it to being on the floor is the reluctance of the Republicans to take away the immigration issue prior to the election. A conservative Republican senator wrote the bill and the Democratic Senators gave in on almost all aspects as they wanted a bill prior to the election. Instead of taking advantage of the current situation, the Republicans have put off the bill in order for Trump to have a campaign issue. However, the Democrats may not be so conciliatory if Trump is president and they will control the house.
Its easy for Paul and MTG to criticise Johnson but they sit from a position from zero responsibility especially the latter. And the truth is MTG has zero leverage and can be safely ignored by Johnson.
The flag waiving was indeed over the top. There was no need for that.
DJ ‘s link to the Institute of the Study of War illustrates a part of what the Ukraine war is about. The world in the last 20 years has slowly devolved into two camps “classical liberal” and “authoritarianism”. Under the latter we have the Nordic, Rhine, Anglo-American, and Asian models or approaches to classical liberalism. Under the former we have fascism, totalitarianism, autocrats, etc (Putiin, Kim, Xi, Iran and even Modi). Despite the huge difference with the classical liberal camp ie Nordic vs Anglo-American, we need to realise ignoring those who are or wish to be in the western classical liberal camp is not advisable to our own success.
Throughout my life, I hated 1930s analogies and refused to accept them. This is the first time I not only admitted it exists but reached that conclusion earlier than my conservative friends. Very few compromises the US has reached with other nations can be viewed as a “Munich” but accepting Russian actions in Ukraine might be the one time it makes sense.
Finally, most of the money spent will be spent in the US. It will be used to manufacture weapons and ammunition that is currently at low levels, once its back to regular levels, excess production can and will be shifted to Ukraine.
A border bill needs support on both sides to pass (it’s known as governing in a constitutional republic) and so far that hasn’t happened. A wand can’t be waved and more angry MTG tantrums aren’t helping.
US Rep. Claudia Tenney, R-NY, made the point yesterday in an interview that the Republican Party, traditionally what she’d call “Constitutional conservatives,” which is how she describes herself, now is drawing libertarians and isolationists. So party unity is becoming more out of reach. And legislating and governing requires a coalition that can find unity within its own party — and then is prepared and willing to barter with the other party.
Wandering Views 
There is no way we can know all the information that our politicians are getting from various sources, or all the possibilities for legislation. I think assuming bad motives and calling people liars is not something that should come easily by us. We can disagree without legislation or actions with doing that.
My comment on Ilhan was based on her lying on forms to get subsidized housing. That is somethings that can be checked out by those who should be doing so. It is sad that it is not being done or that our government agencies are also not doing so. We know others would be investigated.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I just heard this morning about the young man who set himself on fire outside the Trump trial. He has died.
https://apnews.com/article/trump-trial-hush-money-protest-fire-ab7601b86e423d79702b1dda84c5623e
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Though I don’t always agree with him, I consider Rand Paul to be one of the most consistent and principled politician currently serving. His take on Johnson’s behavior:
“As I see it now, I’m not so sure there’s a difference between Mike Johnson being in charge and Democrats being in charge,” he said. “The debt, the deficit this year will be $1.5-2 trillion, and that’s Mike Johnson’s bill, he put it forward, he supported it with a minority of Republicans, with the majority of Democrats. This is not using the power of the purse, this is abdicating the power of the purse.”
He continued: “People have to be strong in their convictions. He was seen as a conservative before he came to the speakership…but now he’s completely changed and lost all his principles…If the Democrats want this level of spending, we want this level of compromise, splitting the difference. The Democrats got everything they want in the spending [bill], and all the hawks got what they want too.”
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/rand-paul-puts-mike-johnson-on-blast-lost-all-his-principles/ar-BB1lBQfS
LikeLiked by 1 person
I agree with Kathleena’s first graph and thank her for posting that. Johnson has cited intelligence briefings as weighing into his understanding as well as his own sense of what is right.
There are also ‘numbers’ to consider strategically, especially in the divided period we find ourselves in now; passing what can be passed and in the form it can be passed. There will always be some trade-offs under our form of government, even in the best of times.
LikeLiked by 1 person
Personally, I’m gaining new respect for Johnson, I think he brings a calm spirit and practical-minded approach and demeanor to the national stage. We need that, though it may be too late to make a difference. Let’s see what plays out going forward.
LikeLiked by 1 person
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Ok ladies, let’s give him the benefit of the doubt on Ukraine and the Israel funding.
Now what “intelligence” do you think it was that made him not keep his promises to close the southern border and stop the invasion?
He lied, it’s that simple. He tried to use it to get support for the other issues, and then did nothing once he realized he had enough Dem support to back stab the R base. You can’t get around that fact, even if you give him the benefit of the doubt on Ukraine.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I doubt Johnson wants the border open. He may have learned something that shows a greater danger to the USA than the open border, with an even tighter time line. I don ‘t know. He is bringing a new direction. I will pray for him and trust him for now.
mumsee
LikeLiked by 3 people
Not sure if this was posted before, but it’s such an informative interview:
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So @3:45: Re language; in the interest of fairness — and, more importantly, Christian ethics which we all presumably have been taught and are trying to live by — it is perhaps more fair and honest to say: “I believe he’s lying” or, better, “I believe he’s not being truthful.” ?
It rightly puts the onus on the person making the charge as speaking about things we can’t (be honest) fully know.
And it rightly gives room and Christian charity to acknowledge now or later that, yes, you may be wrong.
We are all viewing this from afar. We may be wrong on any given issue or, especially our assumptions. We can’t say we *know* what someone else (whom we don’t even know personally) believes.
I believe that Johnson has acted in good faith. I accept his account because it makes the most sense to me. I may be wrong, but this is what I believe his actions convey.
LikeLiked by 1 person
And his account also is consistent with the evidence we have and who he persuasively says he is — a believer who knows has studied and understands God’s word — (while I may possibly have some theological quibbles with his understanding of some finer points) — and is attempting to live by it in what is a very difficult position.
Prayer for him is very appropriate considering the stress he is under.
LikeLiked by 1 person
And thanks to mumsee @4:04 for that good comment highlighting our lack of full knowledge in these situations, let alone another’s motives.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Sorrt, but stopping this is way more important to America than Ukraine is. Voters agree with me. Johnson failed to keep his word.
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Reality is Americans are dying and being victimized due to Biden’s policies and Johnson’s inaction. The same cannot be said about Ukraine.
LikeLiked by 1 person
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Johnson has sided with dems America last, again.
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America last.
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“In statement to @FoxNews, the Border Patrol union responds to the passing of the $95 billion foreign aid package:”
We are beyond disappointed that the House would give aid to secure the borders of foreign countries, but gave nothing to allow the Border Patrol to secure the safety of the United States. There’s nothing more backwards. I wouldn’t have even expected tax payer’s dollars. They could have given us policy, and that would have been enough.”
– Brandon Judd, President, National Border Patrol Council
Reminder: Judd/BP Union supported the bipartisan border deal that was attached to this foreign funding before Republicans killed it.”
——
Johnson owns this.
LikeLiked by 2 people
I’ve already expressed what I believe about the situation with the Speaker of the House and have nothing much to add. It was mildly disgusting to watch all the Ukrainian flags flutter as the House voted to enslave American citizens further on behalf of their pet project. I pray for Johnson the same thing I would pray for anyone else in his situation: may God have mercy on his soul, and even more so on his victims. However, in the middle of all this I have a surprising peace with regard to our national situation. I have no idea what will happen, although I do think the ship has already hit the iceberg (or at least scraped it) and we’re patiently waiting for what comes next. As Believers we know the One we ultimately trust for the resolution of all things, and that must be sufficient.
LikeLiked by 2 people
Amen to that source of our true trust. (8:41)
We all would like to see a border bill passed. But there aren’t currently the votes to do that.
WSJ: Mr. Johnson’s behavior is called leadership, and the GOP would be more popular and better able to govern if more of its members showed such mettle themselves—or had more respect for those who demonstrate it.
LikeLike
From the Institute for the Study of War. (The bold parts are that way in the article.)
“Why You Can’t Be an Iran Hawk and a Russia Dove
A Russian victory is an Iranian victory. Moscow and Tehran have formed a military bloc with the aim of defeating the United States and its allies in the Middle East, Europe, and around the world. Russian and Iranian military forces have been fighting alongside one another in Syria for nearly a decade. The Russians have given Iran advanced air defenses and access to other military technologies and techniques, in addition to a front-row seat observing their efforts to defeat American and NATO missile defenses in Ukraine.[1] The Iranians in turn have given the Russians drones and access to drone technologies, including assisting with the construction of a massive factory to turn out thousands of Iranian drones in Russia.[2] Further Russian support to Iran has been limited in part because of the setbacks Russia has suffered in Ukraine. A victorious Russia will be free to give Iran the advanced aircraft and missile technologies Tehran has long sought.[3] If Russia gains control of Ukraine’s resources, as it seeks to do, it will be able to rebuild its own military and help Iran at the same time. Those concerned with the growth of Iran’s military power, ambitions, and aggression in the Middle East must recognize the degree to which Iran’s fortunes rise and fall with Russia’s. [. . .]
Constraints on Russia’s ability to supply Iran with advanced weaponry will also begin lifting if Russia defeats Ukraine. Ukrainian forces supplied with Western weapons have wrought havoc on Russian systems, destroying thousands of tanks and armored personnel carriers as well as aircraft and air defense systems. The Russian defense industry has been racing to make good Russian losses, and its inability to do so has led in part to Russia’s desperation for Iranian (and North Korean and Chinese) military assistance. Ukraine once defeated, however, the Russian defense industry will remain mobilized first to rebuild the Russian army, but then to resume the export of advanced military systems interrupted by the war. The increasingly close relationship between Russia and Iran spurred by Iran’s stalwart support for the Russian war effort makes the prospect that Russia will ultimately follow through on promises to give Iran some of its most advanced military systems much likelier than it has ever been.
There is little reason to expect that the West can drive a wedge between Moscow and Tehran at this point. Russian rhetoric and actions have become ferociously anti-Western and have come to share many of the overtones of civilizational conflict that have long characterized Iranian ideology. The fact that Russia seeks, in principle, to build an anti-Western Christian civilization whereas Tehran desires an anti-Western Muslim one is not material as long as both agree that defeating the United States and its allies is the top priority, as they do.
The primary constraint on Russian support to Iran, therefore, is Russia’s weakness. A Russia battered by failure in Ukraine, licking its wounds, and facing a strong and independent Ukrainian state will have limited resources and energy to devote to helping Iran. A Russia triumphant over the United States and NATO in Ukraine and with the resources of Ukraine at its disposal, on the other hand, will have ample capacity to repay its friends and support them in their efforts to achieve an aim Russia shares — defeating the United States and expelling it from the Middle East.
The notion that the United States should allow Russia to win in Ukraine in order to resist Iran in the Middle East is thus indefensible. Americans must internalize the unpleasant reality that the Russo-Iranian military bloc is a real and vibrant thing, that Moscow will support Tehran against us and our allies as best it can, and that Russia’s victory is Iran’s victory. Russia’s loss, contrariwise, is Iran’s loss. Those wishing to contain Iran therefore must also support helping Ukraine against Russia.”
https://www.iswresearch.org/2024/04/why-you-cant-be-iran-hawk-and-russia.html?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR0Q_vXxwilhKXV69vtuhrdcIzmGtJVWDVciTeOe4-UNoBFn7fVBsL5Kld0_aem_AeOyO-_ufowHF20hRC-WcwaXcyH2sK7NGNfi8LdeNJq8An9R_1La80tzYMzID4mz3mdnaxo06_aCvqSI0N-TH44u
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Johnson is a traitor.
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Leadership?
He’s a sell out pushing thru the other party’s agenda. That’s some weak $#@ leadership.
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Mike Johnson had very little choice but to bring a vote to the Ukraine legislation. He’s in a minority situation and will not get anything done without cooperation from different groups. Traditional Republicans recognise the stakes in Ukraine along with traditional Democrats. And thus there’s enough pressure to bring it to a vote.
A bill to deal with the border is already written and the only thing that is preventing it to being on the floor is the reluctance of the Republicans to take away the immigration issue prior to the election. A conservative Republican senator wrote the bill and the Democratic Senators gave in on almost all aspects as they wanted a bill prior to the election. Instead of taking advantage of the current situation, the Republicans have put off the bill in order for Trump to have a campaign issue. However, the Democrats may not be so conciliatory if Trump is president and they will control the house.
Its easy for Paul and MTG to criticise Johnson but they sit from a position from zero responsibility especially the latter. And the truth is MTG has zero leverage and can be safely ignored by Johnson.
The flag waiving was indeed over the top. There was no need for that.
HRW
LikeLiked by 1 person
DJ ‘s link to the Institute of the Study of War illustrates a part of what the Ukraine war is about. The world in the last 20 years has slowly devolved into two camps “classical liberal” and “authoritarianism”. Under the latter we have the Nordic, Rhine, Anglo-American, and Asian models or approaches to classical liberalism. Under the former we have fascism, totalitarianism, autocrats, etc (Putiin, Kim, Xi, Iran and even Modi). Despite the huge difference with the classical liberal camp ie Nordic vs Anglo-American, we need to realise ignoring those who are or wish to be in the western classical liberal camp is not advisable to our own success.
Throughout my life, I hated 1930s analogies and refused to accept them. This is the first time I not only admitted it exists but reached that conclusion earlier than my conservative friends. Very few compromises the US has reached with other nations can be viewed as a “Munich” but accepting Russian actions in Ukraine might be the one time it makes sense.
Finally, most of the money spent will be spent in the US. It will be used to manufacture weapons and ammunition that is currently at low levels, once its back to regular levels, excess production can and will be shifted to Ukraine.
LikeLiked by 1 person
All good points HRW.
A border bill needs support on both sides to pass (it’s known as governing in a constitutional republic) and so far that hasn’t happened. A wand can’t be waved and more angry MTG tantrums aren’t helping.
US Rep. Claudia Tenney, R-NY, made the point yesterday in an interview that the Republican Party, traditionally what she’d call “Constitutional conservatives,” which is how she describes herself, now is drawing libertarians and isolationists. So party unity is becoming more out of reach. And legislating and governing requires a coalition that can find unity within its own party — and then is prepared and willing to barter with the other party.
LikeLiked by 1 person
I believe it was Kizzie who linked to that, @5:40.
LikeLiked by 1 person